Marc's Patio & Garage Studio

Progress: 1. All readjusted to life without room service and got most of the "catch up" work done. 2. Got the last bit's of work I could get done before putting 1st layer of drywall up on ceiling. 3. Rented a drywall lift and put up drywall. $34.80 for the rental from HD, completely worth it. 4. Put drywall up on short part of wall that divides studio room from my family room. This is the only wall in my permitted plan that requires drywall... and yes it will come back down after final inspection. 5. Painted the stucco outside. Luckily the previous owner of house left behind about 4 gallons of paint from last time house was painted. I still have some left over. Eventually I've got to paint entire house so I only painted what I had to, except for the patio. I gave the entire patio a fresh coat because that's what I'll see the most of. Some of it needs a 2nd coat BUT... Patio paint is the 1st topic of dispute I got in with my wife. :shock: The studio room is mine to do with what I want, how ever the patio is not. I new she wanted to have the patio a different color than white eventually so I offered to get what ever color she wanted, paint and be done. :D Exterior paint for stucco is expensive and why would I want to paint it twice. 1st she could not pick the color(s) that day, this would take time. :roll: I then was reminded how she wants to paint the patio... a dark color on the bottom fading/bleeding into a light color upwards with the light color solid on the ceiling. Of course I offered to learn and paint this technique. 8) The answer... "You (meaning me) are not going to paint this!!". At one point in this conversation I burst out with laughter and had to sit down. :lol: Now it's white and I am done painting the patio, I will refuse to touch it again, unless it's more white touch up. :twisted: Up next is a new screen wall and door. Waiting on a drummer friend of mine who does screens for a living. While I wait I got lot's of cleaning to do and other odd jobs around the house. After screen install, I call for another inspection. We have drywall screw inspections in Florida now. I think this will be my last inspection, I have no idea what else they will require me to do to get a final for an unfinished storage room. Marc

Aloha Marc, Congrats on the progress. It's getting closer, ever closer! :D I had to smile when reading your story about painting the patio as mrs kendale has begun painting the interior of the house, and I have been relegated to the removing/replacing hardware...no painting. Actually, she does a really great job painting so I dont mind at all. :wink: Keep up the good work! Aloha 8)

Kendale,

I had to smile when reading your story about painting the patio as mrs kendale has begun painting the interior of the house, and I have been relegated to the removing/replacing hardware...no painting. Actually, she does a really great job painting so I dont mind at all.

Yup that's similar to the way painting happens in my house. I do most of the prep work yet I'm not allowed to touch the paint. Only reason I painted the baby's room was because she was sick and pregnant. So what do you think Kendale... if a person hardly does any prep work, can they really lay claim to painting the entire room by themselves? BTW, my wife does a great job painting too, I'm just looking for digs. Marc

Agreed: your wife does do a terrific painting job, based on my first-hand (first-eye?) observations. But you deserve credit from her for your outstanding prep work... To fail to do so is intellectual bankruptcy! ;-) Wow... That exterior looks downright awesome! I'm jealous!! --Keith :mrgreen:

VERY nice work so far, marc! keep it up

Thanks for the comments guys :D Little change in plan. The patio floor/concrete needs to be repainted. The new footer is not even sealed. Screen wall is going on new footer. My screen guy (drummer friend) just took a deposit on a week long job so he won't be able to get to me this week. So I'm going to clean, etch, prime and paint the patio concrete next. Once the screen is up the patio will be done, back to normal WOOOHOOO! Building this studio room has required garage to be out of order for an amount of time. The baby's room (pre baby) was out of order due to the garage stuff being stored in there. Getting another room (well patio) back in order/done will be great. Except it's not the studio :roll: This also will let me rebuild the small garden area outside and get my hanging plants back into patio. Only thing is I'll have to be careful to not trash the new paint on floor (and the new screen and plants) while finishing out the studio room. And like Kendale said... "It's getting closer, ever closer!"... feels like I'm going down hill now :D :D :D Marc

guitardad72 wrote:

4. Put drywall up on short part of wall that divides studio room from my family room. This is the only wall in my permitted plan that requires drywall... and yes it will come back down after final inspection.

Marc, the pic I see with the ceiling srywall - is that comingdown or staying up? The reason I ask is because you should not run the 4' joints in a row like that. They should be staggered: http://www.habitatdane.org/documents/Dr ... eGuide.pdf see pages 6 and 7........ Part of the reason for this is so that the drywall strenghtens the ceiling - and doesn't allow a single ceiling joist to move to the extent that the joints crack....... In addition - it creates short joint on the edge that isn't beveled for taping - which is much more difficult to get a decent finish on. Sincerely, Rod

Rod, Yes ceiling drywall is staying up. I did want to stagger the 4' seams, I am aware that staggering adds strength. However I had 2, well 3 reasons to not stagger. 1- The (outer) ceiling is 15'6" long and 9'10" wide (wide = parallel to joists), the joists (bottom chord of truss) are suppose to be 24" OC. The last 3 joists at gable end are not 24" OC (mucking up two joist bays for OC). Also there is an extra dead-man joist (not full truss like the rest) about half way across in the room where the wall was torn down which was/is used to attach garage and family room ceiling drywall to. Staggering would mean more cutting and waste (not a good reason to not stagger :D ) I could have still staggered off one or two joists but I thought it won't matter/I'd be better off because... 2- This is one of two layers of outer leaf drywall with green glue. So finish look does not matter, just has to be flat. 2nd layer is going up after final inspection. Considering a perpendicular 2nd layer I figured with the 4' joints in a row on 1st layer, it was the easiest way to not overlap the seams of 2nd layer to 1st layer... The perpendicular 2nd layer should add the strength back in that I lost from not staggering the 1st layer.... Arguably not as much strength as could have been but compared to a single layer ceiling it will be as strong... I think stronger. Also PRE installing drywall I added in dead-man/braces in between joists around the entire perimeter of ceiling. Similar to adding in a stud in a corner of a wall to attach drywall end to. My thinking on that was so that backer rod, caulk and drywall will all be installed and screwed well into a corner with much less chance of failure. Here's a corner example of bracing: Also added in braces going down the middle of the room lengthwise for the 15'6" length. SO the joists are perpendicularly braced every 5' or so... I don't think there going to move. 3- Considering the above and my experience with previous inspections I'm guessing I will pass my "drywall screw" inspection without staggering the ceiling drywall. I'm guessing the inspector won't notice or say anything. IMHO this outer ceiling will be stronger than needed... Do you agree Rod? BTW I'm getting ready to do a final plan for my HVAC and inner room frame. I have an HVAC contractor friend across the street and he has not breezed through your book (chapter on HVAC) like he said he would, he's now studying and I think enjoying it. Got to get it back to work on my plan. He's a pretty detailed guy who goes the extra for his customers. He is definatly overseeing my HVAC install. I'll post my HVAC /inner frame plan when it's done. It's not rocket science, I just want to not screw it up. Marc

Marc, All of that having been said - yes I think when you're finished you will be MORE than strong enough........ Looking good Sincerely, Rod

Progress (and whining) Progress I got the patio slab painted with epoxy heavy duty garage floor paint. Got the nice chips in there, once I pull the blue tape I'll post before and after pics. Now I wait for the screen wall. Now the whining: BUT as many other tasks related to my single room project it made sense to paint more than just the new smaller patio concrete. I had to buy too much paint for just the patio and epoxy 2 part paint can not be saved. I decided to paint the small slab at our front door and a half moon slab in our back yard. I prepped the patio: scraping paint, stucco and concrete that mostly I spilled. Had to prep the front door removing layers of paint used to cover-up spills from 2 or more colors of paint (previous owner(s) were really bad painters), remove old rusted trellises and fill holes. Prepping the half moon slab: had 2 layers of paint covering some paint spills, huge uncovered paint spills & splatter and poorly done or worn out caulk fills in cracks. This painting took 3 days, 8 paint removing wheels for my 4 1/2 grinder, etched (requiring rubber boots I'll most likely never use again), primed what needed it and tonight I could not stand straight pushing a shopping cart around case I feel so bent from bending over for about 3/4 the work. At least I got it done right using heavy duty epoxy paint that won't wear like lower grade patio type paint, I really don't want to this job again... hmm still want to paint the garage floor one day... that can wait a long time. Done whining. Marc

Can't wait to see the pictures, Marc! I imagine you can't wait to see what it looks like without the tape. If it's not unlike everything else you've done, including the paint jobs I've seen, I'm sure it'll look terrific. --Keith :mrgreen:

Before and after pics of slab painting below. Still need to do some touch up at the wall to floor corners in patio. I've already got color matched (hopefully) regular grade concrete paint. I am going to have indoor/outdoor carpet just laid in patio anyways, but the corners will bother me. That half moon slab in the back yard... fixing that wall to floor corner will have to wait till I paint the house, and that's not happening this year. Window above half moon slab used to be a sliding glass door and the newer stucco under window at bottom of wall is not doing well. But it does look way better then before... it's just not and can not be perfect. :evil: No pic of the front door slab which turned out the best of all, but this is a studio build forum.... and well the patio is my waiting/smoking room and entrance to studio. Lessons I learned with epoxy paint for concrete floor: - Read directions more then once. - Plan everything out as you only have 2 1/2hrs with paint once the 2 parts are mixed. - Chips only help hide imperfection in floor. - Careful caulking can hide more imperfections. - Really work the "sections" of paint (if using chips you have to paint 2x6 area, drop chips & repeat) together or you will see paint section marks. I got a couple I can see. - I think it was 80 degrees out but the sun on concrete may have been hotter, maybe warmer then 90 degrees which was the max heat for paint. Paint started to dry quicker/become less workable sooner then I expected and caused some imperfection. -My paint job was not perfect depending on the angle you look at it. -The rough to smooth sections of older concrete are impossible to hide with paint. I have no idea whether a 2nd or 3rd coat may help but I'm not going to try. -If anyone finds use of this info, my bottom line on old concrete and painting is: add the chips (or something) to help hide the imperfections. It really distracts the eye and I would be whining a lot more if I had not used them. Marc

Looking good Marc! Back breaking I'm sure but well worth the effort.

It really looks terrific, Marc! 8) But I've got to ask...

guitardad72 wrote:

I am going to have indoor/outdoor carpet just laid in patio anyways . . .

Why bother with the epoxy painting then? :roll: --Keith :mrgreen:

Why bother with the epoxy painting then?

Never want to paint these 3 areas again. Want the option to not have carpet on patio. Overkill on this seemed like a good idea. Bonus is now I have practice for when I eventually paint garage floor. Marc

Overkill on this seemed like a good idea.

Ha! you crack me up Mark :lol:

Bonus is now I have practice for when I eventually paint garage floor.

It's a bonus we (almost) all get when building a home studio...i guess Quick question the paint you used was it a "two part paint" ? Great work BTW

Quick question the paint you used was it a "two part paint" ?

Yup, 2 part paint. Mix and stir for 3 mins, then start the 2 1/2 count down till can't use it anymore. Got it from Lowes, I think HD sells the same. http://www.quikretecoatings.com/quikret ... orCoat.jsp Marc

HVAC Point of this post is to explain HVAC plan for my single room studio. Please point out any mistakes. I’ve been going over this with my HVAC contractor/neighbor… the guy who I ask to help with quick favors on household projects; we’ve been talking about this for months. I/we’ve not run any numbers, between what I’ve read and his experience hears the plan and why. I will be tapping in to my HVAC system for my house. It’s a split unit system, standard for Florida cooling needs; we only put the heat on maybe 2 months a year. Air handler is in garage and the condenser is outside. I bought this system 4 years ago before I knew anything about studio building BUT I made sure I got a quiet system. It’s a 3.5 ton system currently cooling 2011 sq-ft of my single story house. All the existing duct work (installed in 1962) is sheet metal wrapped in fiberglass (with foil) insulation and is in the attic. Duct work is currently the weakest part of my HVAC. It leaks from old joints and regular construction methods from the 60’s. The expensive recommendation (which I do not plan to do for at least 5 years at $5,000 or more) is to completely remove the sheet metal duct and replace with flex duct (standard in Florida) OR this stuff: http://www.thermaflex.net/content.php?page=gkm which my HVAC guy just picked an exclusive for in our area. This stuff is more rigid, harder to damage and introduces less noise then regular flex duct. He said thermaflex would be twice the cost in material BUT for my studio room I’m leaning in using this stuff as I need much less then 100 ft. Because the old leaking duct work most likely I’m only getting half of what my HVAC can deliver. My air handler is very quiet with a multi stage fan. As the unit turns on fan starts slow to move warm air out of ducts, then picks up to full speed. Once the condenser outside turns off the air handler fan goes back to low speed to move the last of the conditioned air through the ducts and then turns off. The air handler is very quiet. I can not hear it from the other side of wall in the house standing right in front of the main return vent leading to under the unit. Standing in the garage next to the unit it makes as much noise as a fridge maybe… it’s quiet and I do not expect any mechanical noise from it. The condenser outside is the noise maker. My next door neighbor (not HVAC guy) is worse located in between our houses right beside studio. At night in a typical Florida community when sitting outside the main thing heard are fans from condenser units kicking off and on all night. Hopefully my build will keep out the fan noises. HVAC guy says adding my 130 sq-ft room (less then 1000 cubic feet) which will be so well insulated will place no strain on my current HVAC system. My fresh air will come from the rest of the house. There is currently no fresh air intake on the system. I don’t know anybody who has fresh air intake on HVAC in Florida. Pulling in Humid HOT air would work against the system. I guess our house is much less then air tight. Luckily my air handler can accept multi controllers/thermostats. When in the room I can turn the fan on to constantly circulate air and still have the cooling kick on and off. I thought about putting a fan in the supply duct to my room with some sort of switch BUT HVAC guy says no don’t bother. Already got a fan in the air handler and energy savings won’t be that great compared to purchasing a fan. My only real concerns (unless there is something wrong with above) is choosing and installing the duct work and making holes in my drywall for duct. I took the time (took forever) to skecthup a diagram of ducts running through attic. See pic. Supply: I plan to tap into existing duct work at a branch and not make a home run with it. REASON is because if I make a home run with the supply then I will cut off my crawl access to electric panel. There’s just not enough height in that area of attic and should I choose the flimsy flex duct for sure I or someone will end up crushing it. Where I tap in, is already two 90 degrees turns from the Air handler. The actual duct size is larger then shown of all existing duct. The main plenum (duct with Air handler supply writing) is huge. -New 8” duct then goes 12’ or so, -makes a 90 degree turn, -then another 15’ or so -and a 90 degree turn through outer leaf drywall at back of room. -At the point (not in pic) I will transition to duct board. -Then I’ll make another 90 degree turn and -go about 2.5 feet between the ceiling leafs of drywall heading toward the front of the room, I’ll have to build out between the inner frame joists for the air duct soffit which will be dead center in the room ceiling. -The boot and vent will supply air from the ceiling which is best for cooling. Vent will be pointed down. Return: I am angling the front half of ceiling in my room down min 6 degrees, maybe more if I need more room for duct work…. And just drew in the duct work, see 2nd pic. -Return boot and vent is on ceiling, front of room. -VIA duct board (NOT flex duct as shown) makes a 90 -then goes about 4’ in between leafs , -makes another 90 up through outer leaf, -transitions to 8” flex duct, -then another 90, -goes 5 or 6’, -another 90, -another 6’ and -then another 90 and 5’ into the main return duct in attic. -There is one return to house below air handler on the wall into my family room, no duct work it’s right there. The other return duct has 2 vents, one in the main hallway and one in our master bedroom closet which I added to the soffit in there (just cut a whole and added boot and vent/register). Both vents/registers will be over sized with a duct board box as big as I can make it behind them before transitioning to the flex duct, thermaflex duct or duct board (should I be convinced and then able to convince HVAC guy duct board the whole way would be better). The only thing I question with this whole thing is: 1. Should I bother having the duct board travel between leafs? I’m trying not to have back to back holes in leafs. Is that enough? 2. Going the other way should I build silencers (plywood box with duct board like other have built) where the ducts come in and out of the attic? It would make much more sense to put silencers in attic rather then in between leafs in ceiling because I have extra space in attic. This took a long time to prepare this post. Hope I’m close to right. Marc

I'm mindful that your permit is for non-habitable space, so you need to be especially careful as you move past the "official" plan and into your "under the radar" phase. Code requires habitable space to have fresh air provisioned, typically via operable windows, but in the absence of those, mechanical ventilation can be substituted. Fresh air must come from outside - not from other habitable space. Therefore, you need a balanced fan system, such as a heat recovery ventilator (HRV). I have posted a number of times about HRVs, so a search for "HRV" should turn up lots o' good stuff. In short, they cycle fresh air in and out of the room(s) and they slightly cool the incoming air by transferring some of the heat of the incoming air to the outgoing air. I believe you'll need a system capble of delivering a minimum of 15-20 cfm per room occupant whenever the room is occupied. Also, I'm concerned that your space may have different climate requirements than the rest of your house. While the 3.5 ton / 4200(?) BTU system won't be strained by the extra small load, you'll probably find yourself overcooling the studio or the house. I faced a similar situation. Marc, your build is very similar to mine in a lot of ways, and your house is even similar in terms of square footage (mine's 1973 square feet, not including about 120 square feet for the studio). The way I decided to tackle the need to control the temperature of the studio is by way of a small (9000 BTU / ¾-ton) mini split heat pump. They're not cheap (around $1700 DIY), but it fits my needs perfectly. I'm figuring the HRV plus ducting, controls, wiring, and professional charging the mini split will bring my grand total to about $3,000. I know that's a lot for such a small space, but I really didn't see any other alternative that would meet my isolation and independent control requirements. --Keith :mrgreen:

Eh Sharward, Did we not "get into" this subject on another post or even this thread. I don't have the time to look it up right now. I thought when we "got into it" we (or somebody) figured it was alright to vent a habitable space with no windows into other room(s) in the building. Hopefully I am not remembering this wrong. Also my concept of using the house as my "exchange chamber" to mechanically vent from, comes from Rods book which hopefully I am understanding correct. Specifically: - HVAC chapter, - page 127 - Exchange Chamber AND these figs show use of a mechanical room for air supplied to sound room: - page 128 fig 7.5, - page 130 fig 7.6 - page 133 fig 133 SO instead of using a small room (mechanical room) for exchange chamber I am using entire house. My HVAC guy thinks nothing wrong of this plan YET, the plan is more his then mine, but I'm fully willing to press a reason to change something. I am going to have another chat with my HVAC guy about all this. Couple things I am easily swayed on in my above plan is to: - Add a variable fan with switch to my return duct (I think that's better then supply) so that I would not be using the fan in air handler to push air in and out of room. The main air handler fan would also push air through entire house and actual supply of vented or "exchanged" air to room would be only controlled by air handler fan speed. - Add balancing dampers to duct work for sound room to help control conditioned air AND exchanged air between house and sound room. Basically the house will get the temperature it needs when family is home, which most of the time. The sound room will get what ever it gets with whatever control I have. Also I don't have a choice on the return duct to "home run" it, it's as close as it can get but I may be able to "home run" the supply... it would be tricky to get it in the right spot but may be doable, again issue is not cutting off crawl space to electric panel. My HVAC guy is going to bring me some waste 8" flex duct to play with in attic to see where I can actually fit a run. BUT I am not easily swayed on installing another HVAC system all together. I'm on the downhill run now for studio and $3,000 is just not in the budget. Unless I am really, really, really swayed then I will be tapping in to my existing HVAC as outlined above subject to revision. AT LEAST I think "as is" plan I won't suffocate, for the most part I'll be the only one in the room, I'll be able to test 3 or 4 people in the room (which will rarely happen). If I find this inefficient then down the road I can add another HVAC system, all ducts are accessible from the attic and I will not have done that much damage to existing HVAC ducts (which I might replace anyways. Guess I also got to talk to HVAC guy about creating "zones" I've heard of other people doing this locally for regular HVAC but do not really understand how it works. Dang I've got to go. Marc

guitardad72 wrote:

Eh Sharward, Did we not "get into" this subject on another post or even this thread. I don't have the time to look it up right now. I thought when we "got into it" we (or somebody) figured it was alright to vent a habitable space with no windows into other room(s) in the building. Hopefully I am not remembering this wrong.

Marc, You are remembering this wrong. In order to use the house for fresh air exchange (referred to as "adjacent spaces) - you are not allowed to install doors between the spaces - the opening has to be a minimum of 25s.f. - and the adjoining room has to have enough opening directly to the outside to satisfy the opening requirements for both rooms.

Also my concept of using the house as my "exchange chamber" to mechanically vent from, comes from Rods book which hopefully I am understanding correct. Specifically: - HVAC chapter, - page 127 - Exchange Chamber AND these figs show use of a mechanical room for air supplied to sound room: - page 128 fig 7.5, - page 130 fig 7.6 - page 133 fig 133

You missread what I wrote, you have to read it again........ When you read the explanation of the exchange chamber - it states (and I quote) "It is (however) contingent on your having a wall above grade to install the unit, as well as being able to devote enough space needed to create the chamber itself. " What you are doing is taking a piece of your space and dedicating (devoting) it to the exchange chamber....... it becomes effectively a large plenum chamber - with no other use - no other equipment - devoted specifically to your HVAC needs - including fresh air - and thus meets the requirements of the code. Page 130 is a figure for a DX split system and very clearly shows the needed fresh air supply and barometric relief. Page 133 is back to the exchange chamber - and the requirements spelled out for that use.......... devoting the space to the chamber means exactly that...........

So instead of using a small room (mechanical room) for exchange chamber I am using entire house. My HVAC guy thinks nothing wrong of this plan YET, the plan is more his then mine, but I'm fully willing to press a reason to change something.

First off - it bothers me that a person holding a license to perform his work has so little understanding of the code and the reasons for it..... I don't know exactly what year your house was built - but people tend to open windows - walk in and out of doors - and run the exhaust fan in their bathrooms - all of which cause for fresh air directly into the home. In addition to that you have constant air infiltration through cracks around windows and doors - including the trims - as well as through the crack between the slab and the wall (in yuor case - seeing as your construction is slab on grade) as well as through things like electrical outlets - attic folding stairs (or even regular attic accessways as the case may be). There probably isn't a house in the entire world build to the stringent standards you are building your studio to. Now, just as one example of a reason to be concerned: I don't know if you have ever had your home tested for radon.... although the answer is probably not - me either - this because even if I found out it had it - I wouldn't be overly concerned with the large amount of fresh air I have coming in to my home naturally - But it could be a real serious problem - I do know that the State of Florida takes it very seriously - in fact they state that there are areas in Florida where 1 out of every 2 homes has excessive radon........ note the use of the word "excessive", meaning that even a number of the "1's" still have radon to some extent. Look here for info from the Florida Division of Environmental Health for their take on this issue: http://www.doh.state.fl.us/Environment/ ... _in_fl.htm Homes that have enough fresh air intake in their rooms fit within the percentage where it is in low enough content to not have harmfull effects on people - the rest need remedial work to be safe. BTW- just for your info - you can have it tested today & test negative - yet test positive a year from now........ so think towards being sure you'll never have a problem. The company I do the vast majority of my consulting with has a residential branch - and they test every piece of property before they construct - and STILL install radon removal systems below slabs =- install outside fresh air supplies directly to boilers / furnaces so that they do not deplete the indoor oxygen content during combuation AND install outside fresh air supply to all air handler units........ and radon is just one example of indoor pollution that can affect air quality in recirculated air....... cleaning checmicals, days with lower outside air quality - all of these things contribute to the need for either direct or mechanical fresh air supplies for each and every room. I have posted this recently here - but to save you having to search it out ( and to clean all of the bu**s**t out of it) I'll place it here as well: I quote from the InternationalBuilding Code - Chapter 12 entitled:

INTERIOR ENVIRONMENT - Section 1203 entitled: Ventilation subsection 1203.1 entitled: General "Building shall be provided with natural ventilation in accordance with section 1203.4, or mechanical ventilation in accordance with the International Mechanical Code." Section 1203.4 entitled "Natural Ventilation" reads: "Natural ventilation of an occupied space shall be through windows, doors, louvers, or other openings to the out doors. The operating mechanisms for such openings shall be provided with ready access so that the openings are readily controlled by the building occupants" Section 1203.4.1 entitled Ventilation goes onto say: "The minimum openable area to the outdoors shall be 4 percent of the floor area being ventilated" Section1203.4.1.1 entitled "Adjoining spaces" reads: "Where rooms or spaces without openings to the outdoors are ventilated through an adjoining room, the opening to the adjoining room shall be unobstructed and shall have an area of not less than 8% of the floor area of the interior room or space, but not less than 25 square feet (1.86m squared). The minimum openable area to the outdoors shall be based on the area being ventilated."

OK- so let's visit the IMC......

Chapter 4 entitled: "VENTILATION" Subs-Section 401.2 entitled "Ventilation required" reads: "Every occupied space shall be ventilated by natural means in accordance with Section 402 or by mechanical means in accordance with Section 403." Subsection 401.3 entitled "When Required" "Ventilation shall be provided during the periods that the room or space is occupied"

Please note- the mandatory use of the word "shall" - nothing allowing you to supply fresh air only "some of the time" when the room or space is occupied -

Section 402 entitled "NATURAL VENTILATION" reads identical to the IBC. Section 403 entitled: "MECHANICAL VENTILATION" reads as follows: 403.1 entitled "Ventilation system" reads: "Mechanical Ventilation shall be provided by a method of supply and return or exhaust air. The amount of supply air shall be approximately equal to the amount of return and exhaust air. The system shall not be prohibited from producing a negative or positive pressure. The ventilation system shall be designed in accordance with Chapter 6. The required rate of ventilation shall be continuous during the period the building is occupied except where otherwise stated. Ventilation supply systems shall deliver the required rate of supply air within the oiccupied space between 3 inches (76mm) and 72 inches (1829mm) above the floor and more than 2 feet (610mm) from the enclosing walls."

Table 403 - entitled "REQUIRED OUTDOOR VENTILATION AIR" does establish areas where constant fresh air is not required: Item "c." in the notes states: "

"Spaces unheated or maintained below 50 degrees F are not covered by these requirements unless the occupancy is continuous".

I hope this helped, Sincerely, Rod

rod gervais wrote:

I don't know exactly what year your house was built . . .

I seem to recall mid-1960s, and I think it has no insulation, which was apparently standard at the time. --Keith :mrgreen:

Rod, YES does help. Thanks for taking the time on this subject. Sharward & Rod, House was built in 1962. R-13 (or what remains of) insulation in attic. No insulation on exterior walls which is Stucco, Cinder Block (with lots of holes for electric and plumbing where needed), furring strips/air space and drywall on almost all walls. 2x4 walls shared with garage had or still have no insulation either. MAN I thought I could just tap into the existing HVAC. Maybe my pocket book is dictating my memories on posts and my readings of HVAC... along with conversations I have had with my HVAC guy. Got to wait for his truck to pull in tonight and spark the conversation again. Marc

guitardad72 wrote:

MAN I thought I could just tap into the existing HVAC. Maybe my pocket book is dictating my memories on posts and my readings of HVAC... along with conversations I have had with my HVAC guy. Got to wait for his truck to pull in tonight and spark the conversation again.

Marc, Print our my posts so he can see exactly what I'm about here......... it should make perfect sense to him once he pictures this air tight container you're building. AND - I don't know that this is really that big an issue. Although I always like to put the fresh air right before the cooling coil on the return side of fan coil - so that it immediately gets the benefit of the dehumidification offered by the coil - it could also be done by adding a small duct with a remote fan that came on when the lights were turned on (just one example) and then on the return install a separate duct with a barometric relief on it - so you just slightly pressurized the space........ figure you need 15 cfm per person when the room is loaded up. Now, this will probably require you to install a separate dehumidifier - because if the rest of the house is satisfied with temperature - you wouldn't want to run the cooling and freeze them out.. But this also makes me ask how you are handling that aspect - for example - your room is super insulated - with very little passive solar gain and no leakage - so it will require very little run time for cooling in comparison to your home - do you have a separate thermostat in your rooms that operate a motorized damper so you don't have temp problems in your studio? Anyway - it's something you have to deal with one way or another - but I think that localizing it would make the most sense.......... Sincerely, Rod

Rod, do you think a dedicated mini split with HRV would be appropriate in Marc's situation, much like I am doing? Or would it be overkill? I have the impression that such a plan may be ideal in terms of efficiency and comfort, although I recognize they come with a heavy up-front price... :roll: --Keith :mrgreen: