Kathy's Barn Conversion!

realy exiting! Did that by yourself, and only you eh? tha's a need trick! :) (wish I had 4 pair of hands like you appearently do) thanx for sharing them pix, their really inspiring. (pix always are, makes me wanna bang my hammer !) ro

:lol: Kathy, I too, applaud you for your exceptional efforts! I must say, I wish you were here in Alaska so I could contract you to "help" me build a studio. Your craftmanship speaks for itself. When you go inside and close the door, is it overwhelmingly quiet inside? Thanks for sharing a photoessay with us, I for one truly appreciate your fine work! I bet you can't wait to get the gear in place and start tracking... Michael

sharward wrote:

Now, admit it -- sometimes you just go out there and look at it -- don't you?? :lol:

More like stare............:P for up to 45 minutes one night......my grandmother was spying on me. She said she watched me stand there and look around deep in thought. And I do....but before you all go thinking that I'm out there just admiring my work let me be painfully honest.......... ...........those 45 minute sessions are more about trying to figure out just how I'm going to execute the next maneuver! I swear I spend more time just "thinking". My brain actually hurts more than my back sometimes. Anyways, thanks for all those great comments everyone. It really makes me feel great that a few people think I did ok. So Steve, are you going to point out my flaws? Let's just move on...and pretend that they don't exist. Sounds good to me. :wink: :wink: :wink:

Moving on.... After taking weeks to finish each phase of a project like building floors, then learning to frame tall slanted walls, then learning how to run Romex around the building and so on.... ....imagine my surprise when I decided to start the next project and tackle the drumriser (expecting at least another week long journey) only to finish the framing in just a couple of hours! The plywood flooring to top it off will go on tomorrow. I guess I'm starting to get the hang of things. I just applied all that I learned when building the floor (learning about joists, joist hangers, plates, studs, sills, and all that jazz) including what Scott showed me, what this forum taught me, and my own trial and error. It was like building a little mini subfloor again. Anyways, here's the pics of the drumriser. It ain't perfect by any means, but it's all mine. :D More pics later this weekend when I top it off with the plywood. P.S. Remember this is for a Hart Dynamics electronic kit, NOT an acoustic kit.

I like! I like!!! 8) Nice work! What are you planning to fill it with? Are you concerned it will sound boomy, like a big (ahem) drum? :roll:

sharward wrote:

I like! I like!!! 8) Nice work! What are you planning to fill it with? Are you concerned it will sound boomy, like a big (ahem) drum? :roll:

Well, I'd be more concerned if it was a drumriser that would house a true acoustic kit with a problematic acoustic bass drum. Since all the drumheads on my kit are silent meshheads with electronic triggers I'm not that worried. Correct me if I'm wrong or being too laidback about this aspect? As to the sound of the "stage" in general, I'm planning on applying the same techniques to this as I did to create my main floor. I'll slightly overstuff it with insulation, gently crush it down with 3/4 plywood, roll out a layer of 30lb roofing felt, and cover it all with another layer of plywood. Honestly, do I even need to do all that again for this small corner riser?

Kathy, For the electric kit, stuffing the cavities will keep it from thumping when you are kicking the bass drum trigger. But if you ever are going to try recording someone elses acoustic kit, you may want to go the full nine yards that you are contemplating. At this point, a little more cost and effort would give you a totally useable all drum riser. Oh and really...You do excellent work, I wish you were helping me as I am framing my place out now. If you get a minute check out the latest pics in my t-mix studio diary post. Tom

Hello Kathy! Yeah I live in the North Shore area.... How far up are you in NH (.... which btw, I may be planning on moving to someday...)? lol.... the best quote from your first post: "... I know nothing of a man’s carpentry world ..." THAT, could be a line to a song, or some movie dialog.... Anyway, quite a little setup you are working on.... perhaps I may get to see it someday! bye for now, K

Here's photos of the finished drum riser floor. I boxed in the section that houses the snakes and cables that will run from the drum brain and a Pro Tools 002 console back to the control room area mixer. Then I cut out a sort of trap door in the floor to keep it covered but accessible. Next, I will be building a half wall all around the edge - enclosing in most of it except for an entry area. The wall will be about 3 feet high with a wide ledge on the top that will act as a shelf to hold a flat screen monitor if desired or other items. Inside of the short wall will be storage. I'm trying to figure out the best way to design/build such a thing.

If I buy you a plane ticket, would you help me with all my framing when I get to it? :lol:

kathy, lookin great, congratulations on your progress so far! i'm just curious, why didn't you sheetrock up your walls before putting in the drum riser? won't it be difficult to get sheet rock behind the riser? or are planning for the sheet rock to end up on top of the riser? thanks jeff

i'm just curious, why didn't you sheetrock up your walls before putting in the drum riser? won't it be difficult to get sheet rock behind the riser? or are planning for the sheet rock to end up on top of the riser?

Hi Jeff, Yeah, I thought I would just sheetrock with it ending at the top of the riser. I'm not exactly sure the pros and cons of doing it one way or the other but Scott (my buddy who is helping me) said that drywalling was the very last thing. Since there is still so much framing left to do (including the vocal booth), I thought I would just build all of my fixtures. If I had waited to drywall it would be forever. I've kind of lost Scott now. He's working a lot of overtime and I've been on my own for weeks. He is trying to come back to do the things that require two people and the things that I still cannot do well (which is a lot) but finding the time is hard. So the reality is........I'm out here on my own now and winging it. He was supposed to build the drum riser with me, he was supposed to build the vocal booth, the interior walls, benches, patchbay buildouts in the wall, show me how to put down flooring, show me how to drywall, etc... I can't do ANY of that, never have tried. But since it could be weeks at a time that he can't come by I decided to just see what I could accomplish on my own. That's why I tackled the drum riser - it was more of a test. It seemed the simplest of my list of tasks so I dove in. I think I am going to attempt the vocal booth alone as well if he isn't available. It sure is getting scary! Sooner or later I'm going to have to break down and ask for some help. I'll have to hire some outside laborers to do the things that I have no business attempting.

So Steve, are you going to point out my flaws? Main one I see is that you're too far away to come help me with MY projects :cry: but that's a 2-way street, I guess... I'm glad you decided to fill the riser, but I'll be even happier if you'll temporarily set up your Hart kit and "kick the crap outa it" - then, if you're happy with the level of boominess I'll shut up. Otherwise, more tar paper and another layer may be in order, with staggered seams an' all. Overall, I gotta agree with everyone else; you kick butt, but good :D I'm gonna be somewhat scarce around here for probably most of the summer (3 years of 1000 hours a year at this site have taken their toll on my productivity) but will check in as I can; please feel free to PM me if you're stuck, and I'll do what I can. I've been so buried lately I wasn't even aware til yesterday that Rod's apparently just had heart surgery - saw it over on Studiotips. I'm sending as strong a positive vibe Eastward as I can, even though I know he's too tough for anything bad to happen... Steve

((((ROD)))) Kathy, welcome to the club. everyone i know that was SUPPOSED to be helping me have other things to do as well. that includes my family, friends, band members, partners, girlfriend etc... i have since employed day laborers on the weekends to help with the drywall tasks. it costs money and is trial and error at times but if you find some good workers, get their number and use them again. make sure you have a good idea of what you want - staggered seams, 1/8" gap at the corners, etc... because they will not know these particulars. also, make sure you have plenty of supplies - drywall, screws, caulk, tape, spackle, etc. so there is no wasted time when you have workers on the clock. so as far as the drum riser goes, i guess that is considered to be part of the floor? is the riser coupled to the floor or is it moveable? if it is coupled, there might be a potential problem in the riser creating an extra leaf? if it is not coupled and it is moveable, then there might be a potential problem with the drywall not extending to the actual floor? i don't know much, i'm just riffing...

i have since employed day laborers on the weekends to help with the drywall tasks. it costs money and is trial and error at times but if you find some good workers, get their number and use them again.

Using unlicensed contractors is extremely perilous. They're not protected by workers' compensation insurance, so if they get hurt on the job, you are responsible. It is also illegal -- in fact, in my part of the world, there is stepped up enforcement on this. See this story that ran in October 2005 near my area about a sting that snared five unlicensed contractors, including this: "The State Contractors Board recommends homeowners hire only licensed contractors who carry workers compensation to do remodeling or repairs. Unlicensed workers often do not carry workers compensation insurance, and if a worker is injured, the homeowner could be liable. Also, officials say that if work is not completed satisfactorily, the homeowner often has little recourse." In fact, I had to sign an owner's declaration in order to get my building permit that states I will only used state licensed contractors or do the work myself (or a combination thereof). The choice is yours, but don't make that decision lightly. There can be severe repercussions in hiring unlicensed contractors, such that the money you may save can be a drop in the bucket compared to the exposure. --Keith :mrgreen:

Yes, I absolutely agree that all the safety precautions should be taken. Everyone I tried was out of a phone book or an ad somewhere but most were all bums and were very unproductive versus what I was paying them. So I finally got a recommendation for a guy that worked day to day for smallish side jobs like mine. he was very good and I ended up using him the whole time. a few times he brought along a friend who was a drywall expert as well. But I know there are also places that you can go pick up workers (probably illegal immigrants) on the side of the road... the kind your talking about keith!!! but i think that very prevalent out there in Cali?

But I know there are also places that you can go pick up workers (probably illegal immigrants) on the side of the road... the kind your talking about keith!!! but i think that very prevalent out there in Cali?

Yes, that is unfortunately quite common here, and it punishes hard-working legitimate contractors trying to make a living. Drywall contractors especially have been hit hard by illegal immigration. What I'm talking about is not limited to that. Jeff, you took on a huge risk. I understand the frustration in finding reputable contractors -- believe me I do. I had a tough time finding a licensed concrete contractor who wouldn't fret at my small job. (And, truth be told, I'm dealing with 48 hours of not returning my call right now.) My point isn't that you'll find more reliable or higher quality work by licensed contractors. (I believe it is true much of the time though.) Just as I'm sure there are lousy licensed contractors and terrific day laborors, the risk of the person getting hurt on the job and your being responsible for it outweigh any potential cost savings you might enjoy... Plus, again, it's illegal.

Keith, I did not do anything illegal by NJ standards. it maybe a different story in California but here it's ok to call someone out of the phone book. Unfortunately most of the "contractors" out here are bums and rip-off artists. i'm also in an area that has very high priced homes developing around my town so most of the contractors scoff at my paltry needs. due to the rude and unprofessional nature of the "contractors" out here, i really doubt that there is any legitamite work being lost. they wouldn't have gotten the job anyway. i have heard that california contractors have much different fundamentals in their approach. there is always a huge safety risk whenever someone you don't know comes into your house.

Sharward & I previously had a breif discussion on this topic & there is one more option... I recently signed my “OWNER/BUILDER” APPLICATION FOR CONTRACTOR EXEMPTION for my building permit. Document states: DISCLOSURE STATEMENT State law requires construction to be done by licensed contractors. You have applied for a permit under an exemption to that law. The exemption allows you, as the owner of your property, to act as your own contractor with certain restrictions even though you do not have a license. You must provide direct, onsite supervision of the construction yourself...... You may not hire an unlicensed person to act as your contractor or to supervise people working on your building. It is your responsibility to make sure that people employed by you have licenses required by state law and by county or municipal licensing ordinances. You may not delegate the responsibility for supervising work to a licensed contractor who is not licensed to perform the work being done. AN OCCUPATIONAL LICENSE IS NOT A LICENSE, BUT A TAX AND IS NOT ACCEPTABLE AS A LICENSE TO CONTRACT..... THE OTHER OPTION: Any person working on your building who is not licensed must work under your direct supervision and must be employed by you, which means that you must deduct F.I.C.A. and withholding tax and provide workers' compensation for that employee, all as prescribed by law. Your construction must comply with all applicable laws, ordinances, building codes, and zoning regulations. I also think if the $hit hit the fan, you had a worker on your project who you're paying tax and workers comp for AND the worker did get hurt... then we (well most of us in this forum) live in Law Suit Happy USA and you would still be at risk financially should that worker decide to sue you directly instead of going workers comp for what ever reason... at that whether the worker wins or not does not really matter because it's still going to cost you money. Also worth noting for US residents... comp for health costs outside the USA is not as big as a deal as it is in the USA... USA is the only industrialized country in the world with out goverment run Health Care. To add of my personal feeling on part of this subject, I do have some compassion for illegal immigrant workers who have been in the USA for a lengthy amount of time, those who have set up lives… but at the same time the whole subject bothers me because I’m a Canadian who moved to the USA. I got & paid for years of work permits, got married and then waited & waited & waited in line and paid a good chunk of change for my Green Card. I never “broke the law” once through out the 5-6 year process. I’ll repeat I have some compassion for long term illegal immigrants BUT I think any body who knowingly employs an “illegal” should be thinking twice. IMHO Sorry for the hijack on topic Kathy :D Marc :twisted:

Aloha Kathy, Hey, had a couple of thoughts for your "drum riser wall"

Next, I will be building a half wall all around the edge - enclosing in most of it except for an entry area. The wall will be about 3 feet high with a wide ledge on the top that will act as a shelf to hold a flat screen monitor if desired or other items. Inside of the short wall will be storage. I'm trying to figure out the best way to design/build such a thing.

Would it be viable to design into your half walls John's "gobo" design? (minus the wheels) Aloha 8)

Here's the permit that I received that required my signature in several places: [url=http://sharward.com/studio/permit-big.jpg]CLICK TO ENLARGE[/url] As you'll see, there are a number of promises that I made, which include acknowledgement of some pretty stiff penalties if I knowingly disobey them. --Keith :mrgreen:

Hey fellas! Bet you thought I fell off the face of the earth or gave up and threw in the towel, 'eh? Nope. I've been absent since late May because I fell ill and was out of comission the entire month of June and half of July. Everything in life went on hold. But I'm recovered now and there's been plenty of progress in the barn studio since I last posted and TONS of new pictures. I believe when I left off here I had just built the drum riser which was the last thing I did before getting sick. However, in my thread I had started posting out of chronological order of my progress. I never organized myself to share the photos with you guys of the finished floor because I needed quick advice on how to build sloped walls. I need to post some of the finished floor photos here to keep this thread understandable but for now I ask that you surf over to my website at http://www.kathylabonte.com to see the full blown and detailed pics and updates of everything that has been done to date. I spent about 8 hours yesterday updating the site, resizing pics, and documenting each step. I will properly update my thread here very soon. Just to give you a quick idea of what else has transpired, I started the process of getting additional power into the barn. The electrician will be adding a subpanel from the main house panel and to do that I needed to dig a 35 foot trench (break thru hot top) and lay the conduit. The pictures speak volumes. So, please come by the website for now to see the latest. I'm back and I missed you guys! Kathy

Hai Kathy, Good to hear you're recoverd (from what if I may ask?). Will check your website!

I'm glad you're all better now and I hope it stays that way. I'll check out the latest pictures today some time.

Hey, Glad to see you're back Kathy! I took a look (Hmmm...that rhymes..I'm a poet... :? ) Anyway, I took a look at your pics and they're great. You've really done a lot of work since you last posted. Continued success on your project!!