SMALL Basement Project Studio Build Project

Glenn, Understand on the thickness of the glass and the angles. I'll have to debate about the angles personally a bit more as it will most likely add a little bit of complication to fab them up at an angle and if it isn't worth the trouble for isolation purposes, I may not do it. Thanks. I hate to :horse: but back to insulation for a minute. I've been looking through some of the build diary photos provided via the forum and John's site and I'm seeing a lot of Roxul being used in the wall cavities. Earlier in this post it was suggested that the cheapest fluffy pink stuff I could find would be the best choice for wall cavities. Sorry if I'm missing something, but if cheap is just as good, why are so many people using the Roxul (or equivilant) in the cavities? Thanks,

use the pink stuff. 3/4-1.2lb/ft3 (12-18kg/m3) density. the air is a critical component. using the denser stuff can end up coupling the walls and the lighter stuff has better TL for LF in many cases. if you have a lot of MF and HF coming through it might make sense to go with the denser stuff but then you may have other issues (like lack of mass or some coincident resonances due to construction or materials). another reason for choosing the denser stuff - availability sometimes the heavier mineral / rock wool is available for less or the same than the lighter fiberglass and you have to fit it into your budget and/or the designer has deemed it necessary - trade offs.

Glenn, Thanks, from what I understand the lower stuff is what I'm going to be battling most, so seems the lighter stuff is what to stick with as you suggest. Bouncing back to windows for a minute - I think I'm going to get some new glass as suggested. Would you agree that two different thicknesses would be the way to go, or should I stick with same for both sides? I was quoted two 3'x2' pieces of 1/2'' for $179.76 or 3/8'' for $154.08

different thickness is generally a good idea.

Along those lines (thicknesses), there will be a common wall - front of both CR and LR - that faces the rest of the basement. My plan was to do two layers 5/8'' on both the side facing the studio and the side facing the rest of the basement. Is that a good plan, or should I do one layer on the outter side, and three layers on the inner/studio side? Same would go with the left wall of the CR, which faces another area of the basement. My plan was remove the exisiting wood panel wall, put up two layers 5/8'', leave a one inch gap, frame, insulation, two layers 5/8'' facing the studio. Should it be 2 and 2, or should it be 1 and 3?

since most the space is encased by the basement walls, only on the inside otherwise you create a triple leaf. on the side open to the basement, create the same double wall like you're doing to separate the CR from the live room. on the back to back walls separating the rooms, drywall layers on the inside of each room only and leave the space between open. build your ceilings so they encase each room separately for best isolation.

Glenn, I understand about your triple leaf comment, and about the space in between the walls. However, the wall on the left of the CR isn't the exterior basement wall. There is an existing wood panel wall there that I am going to take off and replace with drywall. To the left of it there is another ~11' of basement (utility room). In front of the studio front wall there is another ~11' of basement as well. So, what I understand: - The front wall, two layers ea. inside and outside - Rear wall, two layers inside - LR right wall, two layers - Sep. wall between LR and CR, two layers ea side - LR left wall, two layers inside, replace wood panel wall with two layers - Ceiling, existing subfloor - two layers, new ceiling two layers, separate from each other Question on doors: -If I have two separate walls, do I need to do the two door method?

you could use a single massive super door but i prefer the two door system in most cases as it is generally easier for most folks to deal with and gives good isolation and in some cases a backup in case some of the seals re problematic on one of the doors.

Bouncing back to ceiling insulation for a second: I'm not going to have 3''-3.5'' (width of insulation) clearance between the new ceiling and the existing joists, or between the exisiting upper floor (with added drywall) and the new joists, to put in insulation. So do I leave the space on top of the new ceiling and just insulation around the cavity between existing and new joists - or do I compress the insulation to fit? Also, this insulation is going to be touching both the exisiting and new joists, so is that a flanking issue?

if you lightly fill the cavity with the pink insulation you should be ok. compressing the insulation in there will definitely begin coupling the joists.

I think I have got most of my construction plans/concepts down! I was checking out my proposed rooms with the mode calc. on bobgolds.com and the way I see it (with all the other things to consider in the room - placement of glass block windows on the exisiting concrete walls, support beams, etc) I have two basic options: - I can make both the CR and LR the exact same size LxWxH - I can make the the CR slightly larger than the LR Seems from the graphs and data, if I go with the exact same size rooms, they are decent in terms of mode response. If I go with the two different sized rooms, one room is better than it would be and one is worse (and the one that is worse happens to be the LR). Any thoughts?

go with the different sized rooms. the CR is critical for listening and needs every advantage you can give it. the LR can be treated asymmetrically to adjust it to be really nice sounding.

That was my instinct - thanks for the feedback. Now off to find how to build some CHEAP treatments. Latest floor plan attached. From what I understand, corner treatments are my best bet to start with - correct? Does that mean super chunks? Thanks

super chunks are a very good option. then key reflection points - side, overhead, and back wall. then front wall absorption.

This is the rock wool the supplier I'm using carries: http://www.thermafiber.com/images/uploa ... 0sheet.pdf Looks like it would be just fine for super chunks - correct? Bag of 12 2'x4' sheets for $24. That should get me enough to make four super chunks, I think . . .

yea, the 2.5lb/ft3 and 4" thick, you get 4 triangles per sheet * 4" each = 6 sheets per corner (assuming 8' tall). also consider a small bracket/plate @ the vertical mid point to support the upper stack from the lower stack and avoid compressing the lower part of the stack.

Understand on the bracket, saw that a few other places when researching construction of them. I was looking at the method for the smaller version, where you get 8 triangles per sheet. With that method I think I would be able to do 4 superchunks (two LR, two CR - both in rear of room). Also, they will be 7' ceilings. Disadvantages?

the smaller versions will have less absorption. one design i saw was building an open frame for the entire stack, covering it with cloth, and then leaving the smaller stack spaced out from the wall about 6" all around. worst case you find you need more and you build some bigger ones.

After re-evaluating some of my construction costs, it looks like I have a little bit more left over to play around with treatment options. Here is where I am at: - (4) super chunks - two in the rear of the CR, and two in the rear of the LR - possible use of the exisiting drop ceiling panels, stacked 2 sheets together, framed and hung on the walls as absorbers - what else? auralex? My questions: 1) Will the drop ceiling panels idea be worthwhile? It was suggested earlier in the thread . . . 2) Thoughts on auralex (or similar)?

i'd stick with the insulation absorbers instead of foam. the ceiling tiles (in some cases) are rigid insulation so you could stack them and use them.

Glenn, Would you suggest just building a bunch of 2x4 panels then for wall/ceiling treatment? Should they be spaced from each other or right up against? Any links to application photos/instructions would be great! Thanks,

yes, a bunch of 2x4x4" panels and spaced off the surface 4" where possible. leaving space between them and also make sure the facing surfaces have staggered arrangements so no two surfaces are directly facing each other (avoid slap echoes). there are numerous examples of absorber construction on this site - do search on the acoustics forum or simply scan the stickies there. if you can leave the sides of the absorbers open, then that will help to expose more of the absorbing surfaces.

Thanks Glenn, makes sense. I took some more time to browse this site specifically for absorbtion construction methods - I had seen them on a few other places. Understand on the staggered arrangement. Understand on leaving the sides open. I'm trying to decide now if I should use plastic on the face of my super chunks, since they will be working in conjunction with all these other panels. From what I was seeing, if super chunks were the only treament I should leave it off, but if there were other panels in the room I should include it. Thoughts? Also, was considering using thicker 6-8'' panels in the corners, close to the super chunks, where the rock wool would basically be up against the wall. Then moving out away from the corners I would decrease the thickness to 4'' and maybe even 2'' with more air gap between the rock woll and the wall. Does that make sense? I remember seeing something on Ethan's site about moving from LF in the corner to MF/HF on the walls. Would what I'm describing accomplish that?

i would go with the plastic on the super chunks and be prepared to add some to other absorbers around the room to get the best response.

Glenn, understand on the plastic and will get plenty to use in other locations. I have two questions this morning: 1) In looking over John's plans some more I see he uses the slot resonators quite a bit. With my relatively small rooms (approx. 10'x8' ea), do I need a resonator? I was under the impression that the broadband absorbers/bass traps I was planning on would be a good way to go. 2) Flooring: The floor is currently concrete slab. My original thought was laminate flooring, after looking into a little deeper I'm not sure if that is what I should go with. Budget does not include enough for actual hardwood. So my question is, what should I go with for floor, and maybe some installation hints, as I've seen several different methods for the subfloor, vapor barrier, etc. BTW - Drywall, insulation, & grabber will be delivered Thursday. Lumber will be picked up tomorrow! Thanks!