Vertustudio

Hate to be one to say "spend a little extra money," but have you considered using Frontier Design's Tranzport? It's not really expensive, and it looks like an ideal solution for you. I do like the monitor rotation configuration for sure! And no, I'm not being compensated for this. :D Andy

snowdog99 wrote:

"...have you considered using Frontier Design's Tranzport?" Andy

Hi, yes, I've seen that. Looks very interesting. I'd like to try it. A friend of mine has one, maybe I'll give it a shot. It definitely gets great reviews.

Window or no window - damn, that place sure is nice! ...'that an O2R console?

Mike - "Technically" you might have to separate those monitors out a little more. Where you are in the mix position should make an equal lateral triangle between the speakers and your head (I think it's actually something like 16" behind your head). Just something to consider... This is all "Ethan-Winer 101" :lol: :lol:

BradJacob wrote:

Window or no window - damn, that place sure is nice! ...'that an O2R console?

Hi, Yup. Not the most current desk, but I sure do appreciate it more now that I have two rooms. I'm using all the features on it for the first time. Monitor mixes, talkback, running two completely different programs at the same time, etc. Makes me think of the current trend to have mixerless studios, but then people need to buy all these other gadgets (like summing mixers, speaker switchers, other hardware that the 02R already has on it, etc.), to get a multi-room operation going. There's one on eBay right now, WITH TWO ADAT CARDS, starting at $400 with no bids. Yikes, that's a freaking steal. These things cost something like 12K (with meter bridge) back in the day. Mine has three ADAT cards and a TC Unity dual-engine FX processor in the fourth slot, which gives up some really fine reverbs. So I'm still happy as a clam with this board.

BradJacob wrote:

Mike - "Technically" you might have to separate those monitors out a little more. Where you are in the mix position should make an equal lateral triangle between the speakers and your head (I think it's actually something like 16" behind your head). Just something to consider... This is all "Ethan-Winer 101" :lol: :lol:

Hi, I hear ya. What's with the 16"? I've never heard of that. Interesting. I actually have the magic triangle thing going. The camera was behind the sweet spot in the above pictures. That said, the KRKs have a pretty liberal sweet spot, so I could probably get away with spreading them out a bit more. These speakers are not at all like, say, a Tannoy 6.5 (which I suppose is sort of a NS-10 substitute), where you become really aware of what's coming out of each speaker the moment that you shift your head a few inches to either side of the center. I've used speakers like that for a long time, so I've sort of developed a tendency to set my speakers close together. The KRKs are a lot more forgiving in that regard; they have a much broader dispersion pattern. The more dramatic change is when you back off and the bass blooms. Now, this makes me wonder: are all nearfield speakers supposed to be like this - I mean, do they all bloom like that in most any small enclosed room? Is that 'normal'? I have a pair of Event Trias (they have a subwoofer) at my desk at work, in a small, square untreated space. They sound terrific when I'm sitting at the desk, but the bass just balloons out when I move even one step back and to the left or right. I know I have some problems with my soffit height, and I still don't have all my treatments in yet, but I do hope that I can eventually tame the bass at a distance. I really don't feel like going back to anything smaller than an 8" woofer. I'm just wondering what I should expect out of a nearfield. There was never any question when I was set up in the unfinished, untreated basement, with junk all over the place; there was so much diffusion down there! At the end of the day though, it's not that big of a deal. The last two visitors I had in gravitated toward the sweet spot immediately, and pretty much perfectly understood that any other listening position was sub-optimal. I'm getting to understand the KRK's bass in the sweet spot, and I think that everything's gonna be fine -- in the sweet spot, anyway. Best of the weekend to yaz,

inneresting on the bass bloom experience. Haven't had that experience with my HR824's...even stepping completely out of the mix position, the bass stays tight and consistent. The issue with the HR824's is now that the room has been treated for low frequencies and some broadband, the problem frequencies have become painfully obvious. Especially the high mids...allot of high mid frequencies bouncing around now, and I spent ALLOT of time working out room calcs, speaker placement and mix position placement. I'm pretty confident it isn't their positions, relative to any frequencies..it's definitely about doing more room tuning relative to the high mids

Corner absorbers. I had originally planned on wrapping triangular frames (3) and sticking them in various corners of the iso room - equilateral triangles, three feet on a side. When it came time to do it, I was kind of stumped as to how to mount a pre-wrapped corner piece like this. So I decided to put up the frames first and then stuff 'em as opposed to trying to mount wrapped items. I sanded down the cheap lumber (cheap because we had originally planned on wrapping 'em), stained and polyurethane 'em, and decided that they looked OK enough to hang. I hung the frames using three turnbuckles per frame. The drywall anchors got some brown Gorilla Glue. Here you can see drywall anchors, turnbuckles, s-hooks, and screw eyes. This was super easy to do. You don't even really need to measure much, just make sure that you space the anchors far enough apart so that you can get some pull on the turnbuckles. Stay as close to the sides as possible and try to get it so that most of the pull comes sideways/parallel to the wall. Don't use the ceiling as an anchor point! Just tweak away at the three turnbuckles until you have a nice tight fit. These frames are very secure and they aren't going anywhere. I stuffed the backs of the spaces with some Auralex and other bits of foam. Here's a shot of one cavity about half full. I bought a bunch of Auralex thinking that I was going to glue it to the walls, but then I changed up the plan. Exposed foam kind of goes against the grain of my design concept for the look of the studio, which evolved to 'arboretum without plants'. :D So, this was a great way to get rid of the foam. I may actually get a plant, but it'll have to be cactus or something. :wink: For these, Debra glued felt to the back of the 703 triangles and then gift-wrapped them in the lovely green fabric that she got for $1.99/yd. I wish we could find more of this stuff. I guess that's one of the drawbacks of using fabrics that you get on sale like this - it can be hard to get more when you need it. We ran out after these three triangles. We looking for more but it doesn't look like it's gonna happen. When you tap on the front of the panel, it resonates at a frequency that sounds like it's somewhere between a low tom and a floor tom. Maybe these'll help dampen out some specific problem frequencies (like that buildup you always need to scoop out at 250k) in that part of the spectrum in addition to the general broadband absorption. I was actually kind of surprised at the lowness of the pitch. Midnight and all's well,

James Johnson wrote:

"...now that the room has been treated for low frequencies and some broadband, the problem frequencies have become painfully obvious.

Indeed. Certain points in my control room (not the mix position, but on the other side of the room - hard reflective points between the soffit ceiling and the wood floor) have this absolutely stunning flutter echo that resonates like a nice long spring thwack at 350 Hz. No songs in the key of F till I fix it! No big deal, I just need to put another rug down. This bass problem I'm having - I'm not working on it at the moment, but I suspect it's incurable. I'm not surprised, I knew this was gonna happen, and my budget allowed me no way out. I just can't expect sound coming out of my mix position to bottleneck down under that ductwork soffit and behave itself. The mix position is sterling, and I think I did right by putting in that jumbo ceiling cloud. My best solution would be to go down from an 8" to a 6" woofer. I doubt that I'll be doing that. The problem is remarkable only when I have it cranked anyway. And now, all you studio freaks, check this out. Here's my idol, my role model, and the source of my deepest envy! This DVD will feed you ear candy and gear lust for days. http://www.amazon.com/Here-What-Daniel-Lanois/dp/B0013K7ZQ8/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=dvd&qid=1209360814&sr=1-1

Killer corner traps!

Great design you've got there Dude, really ingenious, and they look awesome! You'll already know I love the colours. :wink: Kind regards to you and your talented interior designer. :D :wink: Lou. 8)

Awesome, and it helps me to solve a similar problem that I have! Just checking, but it looks like you are holding the fabric-covered fiberglass in place with the 1/4 rounds. Is that right? Great job!

doublehelix wrote:

Awesome, and it helps me to solve a similar problem that I have! Just checking, but it looks like you are holding the fabric-covered fiberglass in place with the 1/4 rounds. Is that right? Great job!

Hi, those triangles are just stuffed in there; no glue or anything.

East wall. This is the control room back wall behind the mix position. All the treatments on this wall are modular and very easily removable. There's about 2" of space behind the panels. This is the only wall in the whole renovation that didn't get studded; the cinder blocks just got a fresh coat of paint before we built the rack and panels. We built a rack to hold frames full of 703. The entire length runs about 30'. Here are some detail shots of the rack. I glued some cardstock over the lumber to smooth it out, and I stained the bottom bits. Then I glued some felt over the cardstock to finish it off. These frames are about 5 feet tall and 3 feet & change wide. 703 wrapped in cheap muslin hangs freely inside 'em, supported only by the steel brackets in the corners of the frames. Awe-ite! This is the wall right behind the mix position. The other parts of the back wall have used office cube panels in the rack. This is pretty much a storage space that I call 'The Recessed Area'. If I could find another place to store stuff, this would be an excellent vocal booth, given the way the treatments here worked out, which really surprised me. I was just looking to avoid sonic chaos and nothing more, but I ended up with a superb-sounding space kind of by accident. The recessed area is east of the ductwork soffit and has its own ceiling, which is higher than the soffit ceiling. You can't see this area until you get right up to it. Here's a shot of the recessed area taken from a very low-to-the-floor position. You can see the used office cube panels, Auralex foam, and Auralex T'Fusors. These T'Fusors really do a nice trick. The sound here is astounding; big and round with no hollowness at all; the exact opposite of what you'd expect when barking up into a hole like this. T'Fusors have a 1" ridge for laying in a piece of material. I used some 8 lb. stuff and put the scraps in the bowls. Incidentally, this row of T'Fusors is under the entrance foyer at the front of the house. Maybe I reduced footfall noise in this area a bit by stuffing the T'Fusors. Can't hurt! I attached the T'Fusors with Tubetak adhesive and staples. Advice: if you plan on using Tubetak, do yourself a huge favor right away and get yourself a Black & Decker electric caulking gun. Tubetak is good stuff, but it's EXCRUCIATINGLY hard to squeeze out of the tube. Make it easy on yourself I say. It's totally worth the $40 or so you'll pay for it. As you can see here, all this is pretty much invisible until you walk right up to it; perfect use of Auralex materials! 8) Notice the bass trap (disguised as a sofa), custom crafted by Ropefort Knave, 'The Designer'. :wink: This sofa is right behind the mix position now, but I might need to move it back to where it is in this picture if I start getting too busy with hardware synths. Yup, I'm, already cramped for space. So it goes. Small is beautiful! Hope you all have fun the weekend and enjoy the weather! Mo' Later,

That picture with the Les Paul, and the three panels, low light...that is a good shot! I mean it just looks right. Doesn't hurt that there is a bong in the corner either, I mean, sure it's just for looks, but, it looks aw-ite! :) Nice work and glad you had some positive accidents! Happy Mothers Day ;)

nice solution to hang them panels. great work man, and it looks awesome. It's just like that Startrek episode where mr. Spock... .eh, oh well. nevermind (geek alert) :oops:

Wow you have come along a lot further since I was there. I didn't know you had an Udu...I droped a cheap pre-amp off of a shelf onto mine... Love the corner traps!!! Paul

Vertustudio wrote:

doublehelix wrote:

Awesome, and it helps me to solve a similar problem that I have! Just checking, but it looks like you are holding the fabric-covered fiberglass in place with the 1/4 rounds. Is that right? Great job!

Hi, those triangles are just stuffed in there; no glue or anything.

Hi there!! Great project :) Got sort of a noob question about those tricorner traps... Would´t it be better to not fill behind the traps with foam like u did, thus increasin the absorption of the traps? PB

Wow, great job Vertu! I particularly love the DIY TriCorners.... very nice work. Pot, the foam behind the TriCorners will add to the absorbtion, not reduce it. Every little bit helps.

jwl wrote:

Wow, great job Vertu! I particularly love the DIY TriCorners.... very nice work. Pot, the foam behind the TriCorners will add to the absorbtion, not reduce it. Every little bit helps.

So, sorry for noobing, but ideally de tri-corners would be fully filled with foam or other absorvent material, without any air gap?! I ask because i thought an air gap behind would increase the absorption just like in a regular broadband bass trap. I´ll noob no more THX :oops:

filling the whole cavity is better, but costs more. more space (air/wool/etc) behind the trap will slightly increase basstrapping (longer waves) So actually more trapping volume works better :)

THX for the explantion Ro

Hi, My primary reason for putting in those corner traps was to change the shape of the tri-corner space. The 703 triangles resonate at about the same frequency as a lower-pitched tom-tom, and my uneducated opinion is that this is a pretty good frequency to have some absorption on, considering that I'm always carving that range out of my tracks with EQ anyway. The foam behind: I'll be honest; I put it there to get rid of it. I've been asked about sealing the corners around the insides of the triangles. I didn't do it, but I could have easily, because the lumber is already very tight against the wall and there's only the tiniest of spaces there if there are any at all. I'm sure it's not a big deal that I didn't. It's been a while since I posted here, and those triangles are still super tight on the wall, and very easy to look at. I would recommend this turnbuckle method that I used to put these up. Works like a charm, and easy as pie to throw up and secure. Fun too; there's something very satisfying about tightening a set of turnbuckles. :wink:

they sure look great!! :D Thx vertustudio