Get this idea out of my head! (?)

Well here goes another 'insane' idea again: I think I remember something of one (or two?) people who excavated a basement floor for the purpose of increasing ceiling height... I just can't remember who? Anywaste, in digging (enlarging) the internal sump pit through the basement floor, I have noticed that the bottom of the wall extends 10 to 12 inches below the existing floor... Soooo, I got to flirting with the notion of possibly removing the old floor, excavating and replacing it with one several inches lower (thereby increasing ceiling height)... Now, there are other potential peripheral improvements that can coincide with this: 1.) Can put vapor barrier beneath slab 2.) Can reinforce slab 3.) Can install perimeter drain tile (leading to the sumps; complete with sweep tees for cleaning) 4.) Can install pex radiant heating into the new floor... Anyone with direct experience with this sort of thing (TomVan?, Keith?, GitDad?,...) able to provide me with (much needed) guidance.... such as cost, etc... I could possibly get the help and equipment for breaking up the floor and excavating, leaving the slab pouring and some other things to pros... OR, does it all sound crazy... After all, I was planning to have the floors polished and stained, and the cost of that alone of having a company do it would be around $8000 (from one rough quote)... How much more could an entire slab cost? Should I get this idea out of my head? K

Not completely insane, but a lot of work to be sure. Two real-life home studio examples come to mind. Paul Woodlock did this in his two car garage in Peterborough, England. His build diary is over at StudioTips.com. Also, one of the current projects here on this forum is Lee's (infiniteposse's) Mystery Machine Studios in Portland (Oregon): he is doing (and, as far as the excavation and slab pour are concerned, has already done) exactly what you're describing. A structural engineer advised against cutting concrete too close to existing walls, so there is a lip/shelf around the entire perimeter of the basement. This gives the basement walls stability against the inward forces pressing against the walls: the "toe" pressing down against the pressure on the "calf." Get it? So, no, not entirely crazy... Then again, the person typing this broke up much of the concrete slab in his garage and dug out about a foot of dense clay with a shovel and doesn't think that was too insane! :lol: I can't remember... Is a standalone building completely out of the question in your case? --Keith :mrgreen:

Thanx Keith.... for remembering for me... I wrote a post on that link asking for advice.... btw, I'm still with you on your mom's health condition... I know what you are going through... K

Kenni, Hope all is going well on the home front. My thoughts are with you You have the basics but as Keith would say. Get a proffesional to look at your circumstance to make sure you wont harm the structural integrity of your foundation. Beyond that the vapor barrier, radiant heating, drain tile and so forth are probably the creme de le creme of the way to go. Not french but I think you get it I tell customers all the time ...That it would be better to tear out a concrete floor than try and fix it. especially if there is more of an advantage and cost savings in the end Tom

Hey Luftweg, Yeah get a pro to looky and see if you can do. And then demo, take lot's of pics, share the destruction :twisted: Strangely I'd rather see pics of someone renovating there house then go through a sports illustrated or other related magazine. Hm-mm time to stop typing. Marc

Pics pics pics.... there will be tons (too much) for all processes of not just any studio project, but also of the rest of the house stuff.... (I promise however, I won't inundate ya's with too much 'off-topic-ness' -- unless requested)..... Yeah Mark, the pro is a given.... yet I always worry about finding the 'right' contractors; I find so much shoddy work around here by obviously misguided or hasty, sloppy, careless contractors... k

guitardad72 wrote:

Hey Luftweg, Yeah get a pro to looky and see if you can do. And then demo, take lot's of pics, share the destruction :twisted: Strangely I'd rather see pics of someone renovating there house then go through a sports illustrated or other related magazine. Hm-mm time to stop typing. Marc

Luftweg, Forgot to mention this story, I posted this on another thread with regards to lowering a basement floor, but I figured you would have read the story on that thread: My grandfather built an apartment building on bedrock (exactly what type of rock I don't know) in Halifax Canada years ago, maybe in the 40's. 3 units, one unit each floor with a base square footage of around 1500 sq-ft. There was a small basement area of cleared rock and crawl space under the entire building. It was built on poured concrete foundation walls. He (with some grunt help work from me) removed most of the bedrock from the crawl space portion and added actual basement square footage. I'm guessing this added 1000 sq-ft removing 6' high worth of rock, via 5 gallon buckets dumped into a utility trailer hauled away with a ford taurus station wagon. I can remember the exact details about everything but this was done at least 40 years after building was built, its been standing since bedrock removal for at least 15 years. I am 90% sure my grandfather removed all the rock with out a permit and with out consulting an engineer BUT like I said I can not remember all the details. All I do remember is how dirty my and grandpas nose was after working the 1st day without a mask on. I write all the above to say, YES IMHO it can be done.

Yeah Mark, the pro is a given.... yet I always worry about finding the 'right' contractors; I find so much shoddy work around here by obviously misguided or hasty, sloppy, careless contractors...

I think the important "pro" to find is the engineer, AND I've not yet heard of a shady engineer. Hopefully odds are you'll do well with just that part of the job. Marc

Mark: Wow, that's a crazy story; I'm surprised you still have a back left! In fact, I do have an engineer (retained for the rest of the house work), and I did run it past her... Said it could be done as long as there is distance between the current floor height and bottom of walls -- above the footings... It appears that the walls and the footings might almost be one in the same; that is, since the walls are 12-14" thick, they may have simply poured the walls a bit deeper, so the bottom of the walls ARE the footings.... That's sure what it looks through the sump hole I'm still in the midst of digging out... In any case, there appears to be at least 10-12 inches from the current floor height to the bottom of the wall... I explained the things that I could have done at the same time as lowering the floor, and the engineer said, 'sure, but it's the Cadillac way to go...' , meaning of course it might be expensive.... It's tough because the height is 7'2" from the current basement floor to the bottom of the joists.... if it were 6'3" or something, it would be a more compelling thing to do... Plus, I don't think I would want to go down much more than 5" because I will be digging closer to the water table... Yet, I'm pumping currently a level to 12 inches below the current basement floor, so I should be able to control the water... So, is 5 added inches height, pex heating, vapor barrier, reinforcing, (and possibly replacing/adding some columns) worth the cost and trouble of replacing the whole floor? who knows what I'll end up doing, even if anything...... K