New Build Headaches for all you Gurus up Here!

Hi Kendale, and naturally thank you for your efforts and reply. If it's beautifull weather in Hawaii at the moment you'll be amazed to know that it's dark, cold, wet and windy in the UK.! 8) The big picture I think here, is that I'm concerned about depth of room and ratios (re Rod's book etc). The excerpt you posted, I downloaded sometime ago (5:1 Grammy specs I hope) after John uploaded the link at the head if this forum. I so don't want to sound arrogant, as like Music itself you're always learning about studio design. With that in mind, I've read it yet again. (And ................again!) I suppose that I'm already in a 'chicken and egg' situation, in that, I'm trying to design (again a term I use loosely) a room to fit the kit, whilst at the same time trying to secure deals on the kit to fit the room that has n't even been built yet! :roll: So if I Go Air 25's with 30" HD screens in between (which will look awesome), we're basically looking at the dimensions of the drawing I've supplied. Air 25 = (H-W-D) 510mm x 535 mm x 450 mm Mac HD 30" = (W-H) 700 mm x 545 mm If on the other hand, I go with the smaller option, it's more like this: Air 20 = (H-W-D) 575 mm x 310 mm x 395 mm Mac HD 23" = (W-H) 540 mm x 450 So when you look at the widths of the potential kit, the final left to right dimension of the control room changes dramatically, when you look at the depth of the speakers however, (depths of soffits etc) the depth of the control room changes hardly at all! :o Now the really cool thing about the 'Air' system (sorry John! - off topic I Know :oops:) is that the software allows you to digitally compensate for the difference between the 'sweet spot' front and back! Or if you like, the time that it takes the surrounds to 'hit your ears' can be accurately surpressed with no delay, and of course no need for me to be so obsessed with overall dimensions! (Or have I got this concept totally arse-backwards?) Oh and I nearly forgot - the room's got to be able to record anything! One other thing, and I really hate to stoop to this Kendale, or any of you reading, but this facility has gotta be a client puller, crap, b*ll***s I know, but unfortunately in this country (as everywhere else in the world), 'Joe Schmo' wont know how awesome the room sounds until he plays his track on his Mum's stereo. He would however, be telling the rest of the band how it sounded before we'd even had a meeting, powered it up, or given him a demo! Sound familiar? Futhermore, the corporate side of the industry just doesn't take people seriously unless the facility looks the business, and is equipped with good kit that they've heard of! My final design has to focus around............ yup, you guessed it, the control room. I really would like the full transverse control room thing, no forward window, double acoustic sliding doors either side, (like John's garage build 1 on the SAE site) but really don't think I have the space. So, loving John's first attempt at my little project, and Glenn's cool idea of flipping it round I respectfully allow you all to kick me in the butt, and kindly advise me otherwise! :wink: Warm regards, Lou.

Hi Chaps - Hope you're all OK, just an update really to get some re-assurance that I'm actually learning something, and to ask you (as and when you can) to give my current situation the 'Once-Over'. As I said in my first post, I am now involved in a large show production project with a preliminary deadline of Feb 1st. (16 tracks ready for the cast and crew to rehearse to by then!) However I can't just lay my studio design to rest for potentially another six weeks, (until it's all finished and signed off), especially after the initial help you've all so kindly offered. Futhermore, if it happens that forum etiquette dictates that users should be encouraged to help themselves, (and why the hell not! after all, we've all got lives, family, work commitments etc), I thought it would be fair for me to burn some midnight oil to try and get my sketchup skills a little better to help explain what I'm trying to achieve. I've had a re-think on monitoring and the Air 25 system would be a complete waste of money since I simply do not have the space for which it was designed (1200 watts per cab!). So now It's gonna be an Air 20 system (possibly with stereo subs), which will I'm sure, prove to be a far more sensible solution. So here goes with my current proposals, Glenn, John, and of course Kendale, if you could see your way to telling me how to get doors and windows into sketchup easily - (every time I use move, or scale to fit, the whole bl***y sketch goes...well you know! :lol: ) I would be very grateful. :wink: The control room .skp has construction lines in its layers so please feel free to check the geometry. The Pro-Tools console was, of course, borrowed from one of Johh's drawings. (Many thank yous!) I started with room ratios of 1:1.4:1.9 as per Rod's book which although puts me a little long, it still leaves me with enough room above for clever ceiling/clouds design etc (with your help again!), and also 'sits' me pretty much in the 'sweet spot' even though I've gone for 60 degree front end geometry, and 90 degree rear, as per John's first sketch. I think! If you Guys look at the 'Control Room in Place .jpeg, I'm seeing an airlock after entrance door, then iso booth adjacent to right hand sliding door, followed by small storage space bottom right hand corner. This leaves the rest of the floorplan for 'Liveroom', small kitchen facility, and cloakroom (literally toilet and small handbasin). The control room has been saved (within the studio plan current design .skp) as a component on its own since I don't want to change it (unless you tell me otherwise), and you guys can move it and rotate it all you wish 'cos I'm getting stuck again now! (It wont re-scale, monitors and tft's are accurate dimensions!) :wink: If I've missed anything please tell me. If you want to put the other walls in COOL :lol: :lol: :lol: Kind regards, (am I getting It? :?: ) Lou. 8)

Aloha Lou,

if you could see your way to telling me how to get doors and windows into sketchup easily - (every time I use move, or scale to fit, the whole bl***y sketch goes...well you know! Laughing ) I would be very grateful.

One way is to open your Sketchup door template in another window, resize and make a component, and then copy and paste it into your drawing in process. Another would be to open you door template, resize and make component, copy, and then open your control room drawing and paste. Hope this helps, Aloha 8)

Good morning Gentlemen, I hope you're all well, I'm still stacked out trying to meet the first deadline as mentioned, so this is just a polite bump to ask again if any of you could comment on the post above. Many thanks, Regards, Lou. (Kendale, thanks for the tip, I've tried what you suggested, but can't seem to 'push' the doors and windows 'into' the walls so to speak. Wierd when you consider that I've somehow managed to get the small side windows correct!) :?

Aloha Lou, Nice job on your SketchUp file. :wink: I've been poking around with it a bit, and hope to have a few ideas for you soon. Hope your production is going smoothly. Aloha 8)

Thanks Kendale, much appreciated. Hopefully the others (Glenn, John, Steve, Keith etc) will have a similar opinion! :lol: Job going fine btw (Deadline stress 'n all!). :x Regards, Lou. 8)

is it possible to flip the control and live space? this way equipment can go right into the live space without going through the CR... you'd only need 1 window in the CR and on the other side (where the second window would be) hang a glass-front framed art piece to balance the reflections... 8) put in drapes for mix down time... put in a wall for iso booth. you could probably then also reduce the iso-booth/CR door to a single glass door.

you had also asked about putting a door in the wall in sketchup... one way is to draw a rectangle on the wall surface and extrude (push) to the opposite face to cause it to be removed. then using the push/pull tool, adjust each wall face within the hole you just made to size it for the door you want (to me this is useful in existing walls). generally I like to draw the floor plan first then extrude it to 3D. so in the following series of images I'm first defining the location of my door within a wall, then extruding the wall, then marking the top level of the opening and extruding the top section over the door to complete the opening. then just pop in the door... remove lines to cleanup as you desire. note: if you draw the walls using rectangles or the offset tools correctly, even angled walls will extrude evenly across the top of the door opening. if you're drawing in the details of the wall - framing, insulation, rc, and sheetrock, its much more complex so make sure you've worked out the design using simple objects in sketchup first... as far as resizing once you have the door in place - remove the door (if its a component you can delete it, if its a group you probably want to move it), you can move the opening by using the push/pull tool to put the opening where you want then you re-add the door (its in the existing components in model assuming you used a components...)

Glenn - re your second post! You bloody star! many thanks. I knew there had to be a more obvious way of doing that, can't wait to get back on it tonight. :oops: Re your first post, if you look back through the thread, you'll see that your idea puts the control room in front of the rear entrance doorway (which I now know how to draw in properly! :lol:), and on top of the foul water drain cover. I'm going if I may, to reply to this one properly this evening, as I've got to crack on and get this next sequence of tracks finished and in the post tonight, but a huge thank you once again. Kind regards, Lou.

ah. I didn't see that. will think some more on this..

Thanks to Glenn's expert tuition, I've finally got that bloody door and window in! 8) So simple when you now how. Thanks Glenn. Regards, Lou.

Aloha Lou, Hope your production's going well. Here's an idea for your live/iso rooms. Aloha 8)

Hi Kendale and naturally, as always, very many thanks for your efforts and ideas. Just about to start teaching, so will get back later with proper comments. Must just say though, that your construction thread made great reading. Your room looks (and I'm sure sounds) awesome. Glad you and Mrs Kendale got through the earthquake safely, you've laid down the Gauntlet with your outstanding carpentry skills, and as for reference tracks - I beg you get a copy of 'Gaucho' by Steely Dan, (fav producer - Gary Katz), Peter Gabriel's 'So' album (not just 'Sledgehammer') Madonna's greatest hits VOGUE VOGUE and more VOGUE (will confirm your bottom end response and treatment!) Finally (for a few hours at least) Mrs Kendale's garden is a picture!!!!!!! Especially the rockery's and of course the Roses. :lol: :lol: Warm regards, Lou. 8) PS - Deadline 1 on the production job? Met 2 days early, so more time this week for studio design !:D :D :D :D

Hi Kendale, Got a chance to reply properly now (thank God I only teach a few hours a week)! Thanks so much, once again, for the great ideas. I’ll need to have a bit of a re-think tho, as I still have an existing door and a window on the left hand wall as well as the new ones which will be on the right, (as in Studio Plan Current Design Tight.rar above – I did a ’scale to fit’ on the control room component within Sketchup to make it smaller and I still have enough room for my gear! - re dimensions of monitors and mac screens). Unfortunately, I cant brick up one or the other of the exits/windows as UK fire regulations dictate that I must have two! I'm also thinking maybe I can combine the vocal booth with some kind of kitchenette as I will still need some sort of facilities to avoid having to drag people through the house every time they want a drink or a sandwich. Ive seen this kind of thing done on John’s site somewhere, and you can acoustically treat a kitchen, so I know it's possible. Also got to cram a toilet in there as well! Why oh why didn’t I buy a bigger house? :roll: Kind regards, Lou. 8)

Aloha Lou, Perhaps this is closer? Aloha 8)

Hi Kendale, and once again thank you for the idea. Yes, this is much closer. Are you thinking iso booth to the right of the control room? Can we get a small kitchen facility in there somewhere? (literally, fridge, sink, microwave and kettle), I'm sure it could be accommodated in part of the live area, but I feel would look better if it were in a seperate room. You've really got me thinking now :) . Did you catch my post re Mrs Kendale's roses? :) Regards, Lou.

Aloha Lou, I'm glad it's getting better all the time. Yes, I was thinking of iso booth/kitchenette to right of your control room, too. I did read Mrs kendale your comments about her garden, and it brought a bright smile to her pretty face. Thanks! Aloha 8)

Hi Guys and Mrs Kendale :D Ken - why don't you set the control straight on axis so the control room looks directly left right. It will give a wider angle opposing the two end walls and give you the booth right, studio left. Just a thought :D - you guys a flying ;) go for it :D cheers john

John - Hi Good Sir, hope you and yours had a crackin' New Year. So glad you're still watching this in the background. I swear on my Mother's life, I've been trying to look at exactly that, ie control room square on. My problem was that, when square on, it became difficult to keep enough space behind the centre monitor for insulation etc. I've since done a 'scale to fit' on the control room component within sketchup, and I can make this noticeably smaller, and still get the gear in! (John, sorry to be a pain but have I got the geometry correct?) Also this week had a great conversation with a good mate who works for Dyn-Audio here in the UK. "All Air systems are designed to be soffit mounted": (re: cooling/venting etc) :D :D. Also got me a fantastic contact who would be happy to come and tune the system 'big time' once the room's built and the gear installed! :D :D AND (get this), Air Base 24 is definitely gonna be the sub. :D I'm home alone all day tomorrow, so gonna bust my B**T trying to get Kendale's ideas into sketchup including my slightly smaller control room, with of course the 'John Sayers' - 'square on' approach! Thank you Gentlemen so very much. 8) And Mrs Kendale of course!!!!!!!! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: Regards, Lou. 8)

here you go Lou cheers john

Frankly, I'm..............................................Speechless! (Save for - sheer genius!) Thank you very much John, Kendale, and Glenn :D :D :D :D :D :D (Just downing another pot of coffee while I pluck up the courage to politely ask for a copy of the .skp file. :oops: :oops: ) Kind regards, Lou.

Aloha, Thank you, John. :D Sorry for taking so long, Lou. I got tied up a bit. :roll: Since John's got you covered, I thought I'd just post a couple of shots just for the fun of it. :wink: Best of success, Lou. :mrgreen: Aloha 8)

Gentlemen - This is all becoming a little too much, the excitment is killing me! :D :D :D Kendale those jpegs look awesome! Thank you, I feel like a 12 year old :lol: :lol: Quick sketchup question if I may - I've been playing with components from the 3D warehouse this morning following on from John's design. Some of these are of course great, but they're huge in size (MB) and render the program so slow as to make it awkward to use. Is there a way to compress a component so that its file size is more manageable? Before I try to get all the walls in, I thought I'd show you what I mean. (see attached pics) OK - here it comes - Kendale if you and John could see your way to posting the................OH sod it, Please can I play with both of your .skp files? or is that just too much of a cheek? There I've asked now. :oops: :oops: :oops: Awesome efforts and ideas - and thank both so much. Warm regards, Lou. (PS. what do you mean John's got me covered? or do you know something I don't? :? )

Aloha, Check your email. :wink: I tried to attached it but it was just a little too big, even after being zipped. Let me know if it comes through. BTW, nice site & guitar playing! Have fun! :mrgreen: Aloha 8)

Well we're obviously in 'chatroom mode' at the moment - nothing through as yet, but the fact that your trying is 'fabarooney' enough. :D :D :D Aloha 8) Warm regards, Lou.