Improving my studio

sure, it may even be the solution. so if you have it readily available (access, price) it could be worth trying before spending time building panel traps.

After investing more than 20.000 euro for adapting the attic into studio I don't have so many solutions :cry: So, I'm prepared to spend some more bucks, but to rid of this phase issues and maybe to get some more linear monitoring. Thank you again for advice. Will be nice to hear some more comments before I spend next few 1000 :wink:

Have you tried taking your monitors outside to check that they are performing correctly without the room?? cheers john

John Sayers wrote:

Have you tried taking your monitors outside to check that they are performing correctly without the room?? cheers john

To be honest, no :oops: But here's the close measuring (15-20cm pretty loud sweep...) at present position. Don't know how good , how bad it is... Sorry, I didn't use calibrated mic, (TL 173 used) but it's same for both speakers. BTW, It's obvious that I have to check trim for hf response. AMS8 have +/- 3db from 2.2khz trim, but WILL DO THAT SOON. Tell me what you think about :wink:

And here's one more graph... Measuring of rear wall absorption. I placed the mike in front of rear wall inside room (brown line) , and the other line (yellow) is mike placed between isolation and brick wall. Difference in position is around 20 cm , just to be behind... Again, don't know how good, how bad it is.... :?

This week I'm planing to do something with rear wall. To be honest I'm not sure what to do, but will try with adding some more rock wool. Also, can somebody confirm accuracy of the acoustic calc. http://www.mhsoft.nl/user/ac.asp I know that Helmholtz's formula is wrong, but what about panel traps and diff. calculation?

Polite bump :oops: I'm not sure what to do :? BTW, John , If you want to refresh the memory about the construction, here's the link. http://www.johnlsayers.com/phpBB2/viewt ... c&start=30

OK, I did what I did. Adding 5cm of rock wool at the back wall didn't made so big improvement :cry: But , anyway I was forced to remove hangers (16 big one) just to check what's going on "on the back". That was real fun, lot of dust and rock in my ears! Biggest surprise was that there is no change on response without hangers! Not at all even when I look at non smoothed graph :?: So, I will remove that thing away( I probably did something wrong.... in construction, or they just don't work at this place). Anyway , I have to reconstruct the left side of the rear brick wall, to make symmetry, but have so small place to work and will be impossible to do any changes after. What I expect from tis symmetry is similar response in both separate channels. Am I right? If I am, I will still be at the beginning , or let's say , I will have same modal problem as before, but uniform at L and R channel. Then, will be nice if I can do some plan and predict frequencies needed to be treated after, and simply make some bass traps (I was planning to go with panel traps, as they are only possible because available depth of 35 cm from wool to brick wall). I need to install them in some order, and after installing I can finish the wall behind. (I'm talking about wall what need to be made because of symmetry). After that I will never be able to change something. :? Can you help me and try to suggest what bass traps should I build at the back?

I hate to be lazy , so I did some measuring and also have some more questions. Here's the graph showing the 5 cm more wool at the rear false wall Also I have the question about my ceiling. If symmetry is needed to proper stereo image, is this situation problematic? Other picture shows the possible solution with adding one more false ceiling with same angle like the right side... :idea:

Talk about a claustrophobic picture :shock:

VSpaceBoy wrote:

Talk about a claustrophobic picture :shock:

What to say, I'm in symmetry-phobic mood :wink:

Just my 2 bits here but I think you need to take the whole cavity behind your false wall and stuff it FULL, as in solid, no gaps, of 3-5 lbs/ft3 of rockwool, floor to ceiling. You need a great deal of broadband absorption. If the hangers didn't do it, maybe the solid rockwool will. Helluva lot let expensive than adding masonry to bring symmetry to the back wall. Also, the roof might be your problem. With that ceiling, its like you have a corner directly above your head, more reflections at any angle. Next, try filling that space with wool and see if something changes. The room is too small to do anything but massive broadband absorption, IMHO. -bassman

Thanks Bassman. I was thinking about that, but after adding the 5cm I don't know what to think... At right side I have about 40cm available, but on the left there is much more. If I decide to go with broadband that will cost me around 1000Eu :!: At the end, I don't know how to stick 40cm in the 40cm cavity! Only if I move the false wall and start from beginning. :cry: I will really go crazy about this :!:

5cm won't do diddly at the freqs you're dealing with. Another 40cm might just start to do something. From your designs, its looks like a nice place. Don't come up short on treatment. Budgets ALWAYS run over. I'm working on a church right now for my studio and have blown another 25k over budget just on the apartment rehabs here....... :evil: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: -bassman

As far as getting the wool in there, just cut it to fit and stack many layers until its full. :roll:

Yes, you're right about budget... :cry: And that 1000EU is not so much compared to my suffer about sound :? Just not sure will this solve the problems.... Of course not the all of them. I just need some +/- 6db response :cry: BTW can this be the problem too? My soffit front baffle don't goes rigid to the ceiling. Upper part is just filled with mixture of fluffy wool and rockwool???

I moved the measuring position 80cm to front wall and here's the result. This position is only possible if I move the desk to the front wall. But, response looks much better :wink: Right channel is slightly worse then left (I messed something with graph export and will post that later) but all peaks a nulls are at same frequencies. Anyway I'm planning to correct rear mass wall and hope that response will almost the same on both channel. My question is, is that "near-field soffit" mix position usual? Maybe a dump question, but have to ask because in this situation speakers are still in the 60 degrees angle ....

I finally finished the back of the false wall. I added mass wall (2cm Plywood). To be honest I don't see some great progress about, but now I did that too, and that's it :wink: Really don't have the idea what to do next and fix that low end issues :cry: HELP Also, I think I have some more comb filtering caused by console near the front and soffit wall. What should I do to avoid that?

one feature of moving closer to the front is that your mix position is not in the middle of the room so some of the modes your were experiencing are now behind you... another consideration - do your soffits extend all the way to the floor or are the lower parts absorbing? do you have a carpet on the floor under the console? you may need to get the ceiling symmetry corrected. you could (potentially) add a sloped low-front, high back false ceiling and put in some hanging absorbers above it. that would help with symmetry and add some bass absorption (plus give you that cool control room look...:) )

Thanks Glenn. Yes, I understand that I escaped from the modes :wink: I would be much happier if I can move a little back....The down part is bass trap, covered with 3cm wool, something like John suggests in his soffit drawings. I presume that you asking me that because desk reflections. Only I can do is to cover part of desk with some insulation :?

do you have a carpet on the floor under the console?

No, just the small part is covered with carpet (maybe the 0.7m in front of soffit), rest of room is parquet.

you could (potentially) add a sloped low-front, high back false ceiling and put in some hanging absorbers above it

Please can you describe more what I have to do? Not sure what is sloped low-front. High back false ceiling, are you thinking about extending the existing cloud? Thanks :D

Hi i'm not a pro in studio accoustics but think i've read that it would be better to avoid right angles, you have two of them in the back of the room. and when i look close to your soffit angles, they are not 30°, aren't they? see pic below from your original plan... because these are only small issues i think you should have a look at your ceiling, like gullfo mentioned. do a search, there was a thread about false ceilings in the last few months, and john posted some nice plans... btw. could you post some real pic of your CR? I'm just curious... btw. nr 2. i would be glad to have your room response in my basement studio ;-) Greez Roman

Right! Not an expert, but good eye precise like the swiss knife :wink: Yes, the soffit is moved to 25 dg, I don't know how? Hope that's not the big problem because moving the doors and soffit is mission impossible now :? About angles at the rear of the room, I just followed the John's drawings. Yes, that's 90 deg. and probably can be the problem :wink: Where is the John these days? I'm sure he had something in mind but I don't know what (I'm not sarcastic). About my studio building progress check this link http://www.johnlsayers.com/phpBB2/viewt ... c&start=30 Thanks a lot for comments :wink:

didn't know you had a cloud :) what i was thinking is a lot of designs use a false ceiling that slopes from low in the front to higher in the back. then with the ceiling height you have, you could easily put in a bunch of hangers to help with the bass absorption.

what i was thinking is a lot of designs use a false ceiling that slopes from low in the front to higher in the back. then with the ceiling height you have, you could easily put in a bunch of hangers to help with the bass absorption.

You know what's terrible? Terrible is that I have bunch of hangers between cloud and ceiling and if they are working like the hangers from behind of rear false wall (nothing) then I have to remove them also and do something else. Maybe I didn't made them properly? I made them from 3mm mdf different sizes from 50x70 to 120x180 cm (those from the back were larger 150x250cm) wrapped with fluffy insulation , hanging freely ... :?

hi again just clicked through your building thread, looks great! one question. can you describe exactly how your rear wall is constructed, i didn't see any clear picture of this wall. is it covered with fabric, slats, or else? greez Roman the swiss knife ;-)