NEW Basement Studio Design in New York. Looking for advice

Should I put this insulation in here or no?

:thu: Definitely! - Stuart -

So I've been making a ton of progress! I'll have a bunch of photos to post next! For now I had a question regarding fabric underlayment. According to Guilford of Maine - they recommend using Tyvek as a opacity layer/underlayment - just behind the finish layer of fabric and to cover the wood/703 behind it. I know Stuart has mentioned that any cheap fabric will work as long as it is breathable. So I have a bunch of FREE rolls of this stuff laying around at my shop at work. It is definitely breathable. Reinforcing Fabric: http://www.mapei.com/US-EN/Tile-&-Stone-Installation-Systems/Waterproofing-Membranes/Reinforcing-Fabric Would this work? (by the way - I don't think this product is waterproof by itself, its part of a membrane system under tile and possibly some roofing applications)

here's a few update photos as well - i know they are not quality pics but I haven't cleaned up the place enough to take out the good camera and have a photo shoot yet. Progress pics: Superchunk in corner behind speaker stand (with a temp bass hanger for placement) Bass hangers before being lowered into place. There are a total of 9 bass hangers below each speaker box + surrounding the concrete speaker stands. Speaker box before fill Where I'm at now: I DID run the tests as Stuart mentioned (played loud music and swept a sine wave) to make sure there were no strange vibrations or harmonic reaction that cause the speakers to wobble. The framed soffit wall isn't touching the speaker box at all - there's a gap there I'll take some close-up pics of that. If I push on the speaker box with my hand, I can rock it back and forth slightly (it is only sitting on those sorbothane pads) I can take a short video to show this. The pink fluffy insulation isn't packed tight at all, just basically laying in there along with all of the scraps I've accumulated during the whole process. Once I put in a few more noggins, I'm pretty much ready for my front soffit walls to go in. That box in between the speakers is my "Machine Room" or basically just my power amp box. It is tied into the AC system (that is that 4" flex duct back there) The speakers themselves are also passively vented with chicken wire chimney through all that pink fluffy stuff. They exit not toward the face of the speaker, but rather towards the middle. That middle area that is open now, will have a small 28" TV flush mounted just above the AMP box. The wall will be finished with fabric, and behind it, probably (2) more bass hanger traps to either side of the box (more if I can fit them). If you zoom into the photo - you may even be able to see the small stub of the chicken wire chimney sticking out (right next to the 4" silver flex duct). That AMP box also has a chimney (not attached yet - its actually that thing on the floor in the bottom right of the last photo) with duct liner and the bottom section of the box is a baffle box (you can see the inlet bottom left). It will have a glass door in the front to seal it up. I may have went overkill isolating the amps as the fans noise isn't exactly low frequencies that are the most diff to isolate. So it is made of only (1) layer of 5/8" OSB.

So I have a bunch of FREE rolls of this stuff laying around at my shop at work. It is definitely breathable

It looks like it should work from the acoustic point of view, but I'm not so convinced about the aesthetics. The main purpose of that rear liner is to make it hard to see inside, through the weave of the finish fabric. I use black cloth for that, as it seems to block light better than white cloth. You are trying to stop as much light as possible getting into the device, and also stop as much light as possible coming back out. That stuff you have might be fine for that: I would try it out and see how it goes on a large test section, done temporarily. If it works, and you can't see anything inside, then greate! But if if doesn't work well, then switch over to cheap black cloth.

Speaker box before fill

Man, those things are huge! You don't really appreciate the full scale of them, visually, until you see it like that. One comment: I'm not sure that the gap is large enough, right down near the floor, between the bottom of the absorber box and the floor. That "slot" down there should be at least 12" high (30 cm). Yours doesn't look that big... Another comment? What are you plans for the ceiling? Normally, you would have an angled, hard-backed cloud up there, but your speakers are so huge and the ceiling is low, so I'm not sure you'll be able to do that: the cloud would be partly covering the speaker. That's going to be a challenge...

I DID run the tests as Stuart mentioned (played loud music and swept a sine wave) to make sure there were no strange vibrations or harmonic reaction that cause the speakers to wobble.

And all is OK? No vibrations or wobbles?

If I push on the speaker box with my hand, I can rock it back and forth slightly

Right, but does it do that when you are playing loud, low-frequency sounds, such as a thumping kick drum or floor tom? Or maybe a six string bass playing way down low? It's coming along nicely, though! Looking good... - Stuart -

Stuart! Always great to get a response from you!

But if if doesn't work well, then switch over to cheap black cloth.

I'll stop at the store today and get a small roll of black fabric, and a see which one works better, I guess black makes more sense. Also this white stuff is not the most opaque fabric so I think you may be right.

One comment: I'm not sure that the gap is large enough, right down near the floor, between the bottom of the absorber box and the floor. That "slot" down there should be at least 12" high (30 cm). Yours doesn't look that big...

Yeah you're definitely right about that! thanks for catching that, it should be a pretty easy fix, i think I can cut it up a bit higher without having to remove the wall at all, just carefully get a sawzall in there.

Another comment? What are you plans for the ceiling? Normally, you would have an angled, hard-backed cloud up there, but your speakers are so huge and the ceiling is low, so I'm not sure you'll be able to do that: the cloud would be partly covering the speaker. That's going to be a challenge...

So I am planning on doing some form of a cloud, but as you mentioned I don't have a lot of space to work with AT ALL. I actually originally planned to have my return duct run overhead in that same area so I would have symmetrical air-flow, but there was just no room for it (even if i pancaked the duct to it's max, it would have been like 28" x 4" before insulation to maintain the 300 FPM). So now my return duct/grill is to the left side of the room. I'll try to make this more clear with some photos and/or sketchup. I also am planning on putting a TV/Monitor between the speakers, pretty high up as well. So yeah this is definitely a big challenge. I probably won't get to do the normal hard backed cloud you mentioned, maybe I'll be able to get a few inches of trapping up there? Any suggestions would help. Now I don't know if this SORT of helps the situation, but the center listening axis on these speakers is from the bottom 15" driver (dual concentric/coaxial driver). The top 15" driver is the subwoofer. On top of that, I have an external crossover at 80Hz. So I'm not saying that the top cone isn't doing ANYTHING, but it's definitely doing a whole lot less less that it would without the crossover. Inside the Urei box, there is a 3-way network. Trying to find info on the actual bottom crossover freq is a bit difficult. The top subwoofer was often referred to as the "helper woofer". From what I gather it was crossed over as low as 100Hz. So the top woofer may only be doing the work of producing around +/- 80Hz-100Hz range. This is why I'm thinking more trapping may be better that reflecting overhead? So I think whatever cloud I do install, can go pretty much as low as the top of the cone, or maybe even lower? (might look weird). Its about 6-7" to the top of the speaker box from the ceiling, and maybe 10" roughly to the top of the cone/woofer. So I was hoping I could get the cloud down as low as 10" in the front of the room (may cover the top of the speaker box itself, but not the cone), and just angle it back from there. If I partially obstruct the top cone, I can go 12" down in the front of the room. I know I need a good angle to maintain my RFZ in the vertical plane which is going to be the main challenge.

And all is OK? No vibrations or wobbles?

:yahoo: all good. I tested it WITHOUT the crossover as well so it was getting full range. I went real slow with the sine wave generator in all the low freq's to see if I could get a reaction out of them but nothing. Tried some deep house music as well and some other stuff with a deep kick and bass. No visible movement at all. the only time I can get visible movement (rocking, wobbling) is if i push it by hand. Also, although the insulation is loosely filled, there is definitely noticeably less rocking/wobbling that happens when I push the box now that is filled. I think just the weight of the insulation itself sitting on top of the box, and the friction along the sides, is somewhat dampening the rocking even further. I hope this is a good thing. There's definitely no flanking or overly compressed insulation anywhere. The extreme weight of these things gives it a very firm/solid feel overall.

It's coming along nicely, though! Looking good...

:D :D :D honestly this is the best thing I've heard all year. Thanks StuArt!

everything is taking forever but here is a few update photos:

It is looking awesome!!!! Keep up the good work! Greg

few more update pics

more pics!

very very nice. although pink lighting can cause aggression, not sure why but there was a study done about 15 or so years ago on different colored light effects on people and the researchers were surprised by heightened tensions and increased aggression of pink light. so maybe save the pink lights for the heavy metal sessions :)