What to do about these corners?

vocomotion · Post by **vocomotion** » Wed Mar 23, 2005 12:59 pm

I've got the framing done on my new studio and something just occurred to me...what do I do with the corners I've designed? I've attached the basic floorplan of the studio. There are two 45-degree corners cut into the front of the CR. The walls are all going to be filled with Thermafiber (acoustic rock-wool batting), but what about those two cavities behind the walls in the corner? Should I leave them empty? Will they resonate and cause problems later? Should I stuff them full of Thermafiber or Fiberglass batting?

Some other info about the studio: it's in a basement, cinderblock exterior walls. 4" soundproof concrete ceiling and concrete floor (will be covered with hardwood laminate). The ceiling is low (7'6" before suspended ceiling is put in). I focus on recording a cappella groups and vocals/voiceovers. Not many instruments in here, except maybe some acoustic guitars or digital piano.

Let me know if I'm missing somthing. I've looked around the Forum to see if anyone's mentioned what to do with these corners, but haven't found anything yet.

Thanks!
--> freddie

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Freddie Feldman [freddie@vocomotion.com]
VOCOMOTION
Vocal-Centric Recording Facility, Studio Products, and Web Development
Board Member, Contemporary A Cappella Society (CASA)

http://www.vocomotion.com
AOL Instant Messenger Screen Name: VOCOMOTION
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vocomotion · Post by **vocomotion** » Fri Mar 25, 2005 1:53 am

Well, we couldn't wait any longer for an answer. My contractors needed to know what to do with the corners before they hung the drywall. So, we had a few extra bags of Thermafiber and we stuffed the corners full of the stuff. That should keep it from resonating (I guess)...

--> freddie

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Freddie Feldman [freddie@vocomotion.com]
VOCOMOTION
Vocal-Centric Recording Facility, Studio Products, and Web Development
Board Member, Contemporary A Cappella Society (CASA)

http://www.vocomotion.com
AOL Instant Messenger Screen Name: VOCOMOTION
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cadesignr · Post by **cadesignr** » Fri Mar 25, 2005 3:27 am

something just occurred to me...what do I do with the corners I've designed?

If you "designed" them, what were they designed "to do"? USUALLY, "designers" design for a purpose. If you had nothing in mind for the corners, why did you build them in the first place? Usually, PLANNING comes BEFORE construction.

My contractors needed to know what to do with the corners before they hung the drywall.

Well, you only had two options at this point..fill or not fill. You chose the best one. Besides, what else could you do with them, besides build slat absorbers, or soffets if its a front wall, or run ducting down them, or build in rackmounts, or a XLR panel, or .....actually, if they are not soffets, you COULD have simply made a corner RESISTANCE absorber easier than framing and shiething it with drywall. Would have been cheaper too considering contractors rates. But hindsight is 20/20.

I've looked around the Forum to see if anyone's mentioned what to do with these corners, but haven't found anything yet.

Why would someone mention "what to do with them" on another thread? Afterall, you "designed" them.

Thats like designing a wheel, and ask what its for. DUH!

Let me know if I'm missing somthing.

No comment.

vocomotion · Post by **vocomotion** » Fri Mar 25, 2005 3:42 am

Thanks a lot, you've been very helpful (sarcastic). I asked a question quite nicely and gave quite a bit of information about my project to help with an answer. I guess I'll just keep my questions to myself, when it comes to this board, since I don't have any need for smartass responses.

Thanks for nothing...

--> freddie

cadesignr · Post by **cadesignr** » Fri Mar 25, 2005 4:35 am

Thanks for nothing...

What did you want? You already solved the riddle. I was simply giving you the means by which you don't make the same mistake again.

I don't have any need for smartass responses.

Typical.
It wasn't smartass. It was the truth, regardless if you don't understand the concept. Brilliant design requests comment. Design with no purpose DEMANDS comment, however you want to take it.

cadesignr · Post by **cadesignr** » Fri Mar 25, 2005 5:05 am

I too have a problem. I "designed" something today, without a clue what its for. Could someone please figure out for me how to use it?

fitZ
PS. Excuse me Steve. Old farts never die, they just get grumpier and their resistance to temptation approachs zero.

knightfly · Post by **knightfly** » Fri Mar 25, 2005 10:51 am

Rick, I understand most, if not all your frustration - however, I'm guarding THIS particular site with a 12-gauge against the type of vitriolic crap I see on other boards - the intent here is to HELP and EDUCATE, not belittle and Irritate - please remember that.

What I find that helps is to remember the really dumb things I've done myself, through a lack of knowledge. I consider that there's a HUGE difference between ignorance and stupidity - my definitions are simple; Ignorance is not knowing. Stupidity is knowing, but doing it wrong anyway. This board can't do anything about stupidity (other than stay polite :=) so I try to concentrate on Education.

Now I ask you; do you learn more when someone is YELLING at you, or when they are leading you step by step to a (hopefully) logical conclusion? Please stick to the ORIGINAL golden rule here, and treat others as I've treated you.

Freddie - your turn now.

First, welcome to the board; I'm sorry your experience hasn't been the most pleasant, and I'd like to help you make any future experiences better.

Things to do toward that goal -

Plan ahead - I know virtually ALL contractors are in a hurry; time is money, especially if they've bid a job at a fixed price. Unfortunately, with the possible exceptions of Nashville, New York, LA, etc, the odds of finding a contractor who has ANY clue how to build acoustic construction is almost NIL - so in order to be successful in NOT violating the physics of good sound control, you either need to pay a LOT of money to a Specialist, or spend the time to educate YOURSELF and then stand over your contractor with a HAMMER and don't let him do things your new-found knowledge says will NOT WORK for you.

That's what this board is intended to help with - but learning takes time, and attention to detail...

IF you look at the top of the Construction forum, there is an "Announcement" - the very TOP ONE -

http://www.johnlsayers.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=3231

near the bottom of that first post, there is a warning that it may take a few days before you get an answer. That is because I do this for FREE; (In most cases, people get more than what they pay for) - this also means that I have to consider my regular job, paying consultation work, and occasionally eating and sleeping BEFORE I can help members here; my schedule is not unlike that of a fireman, working 12-hour shifts (2 12-hour days, half-day off, 2 12-hour nights, 3-1/2 days off) occasionally I'm required to work two extra night shifts, which pays fairly well but tends to make me grouchier than usual (more editing before I post :=) -

For those reasons, responses may indeed take up to a week (see the above link again)

Now, due to one member not remembering this is a POLITE forum and another possibly not understanding that I don't write UN-NECESSARY words if I can help it (EVERYTHING in that link is pertinent), I've spent all the time I had "smoothing the waters", and need to leave for work; I'll review your posts/questions within the next couple of days (along with a couple dozen others) and, whether you still care or not, try to help you keep from making any mistakes I see the NEXT time you build, or for the REST of your project, etc -

Again, I'm sorry you had a "less than stellar" experience, hopefully we can do better next time... Steve

cadesignr · Post by **cadesignr** » Fri Mar 25, 2005 2:32 pm

Rick, I understand most, if not all your frustration

You understand my frustration? With what? Maybe I just misunderstood the point of this post. How do you help someone who designs and builds first, and THEN asks what to do about something while the contractor is standing there? Since NO ONE responded, he made a decision. That is WHY I answered in the form that I did. It was to inform him the NORMAL sequence of events when building. I suppose I should have simply linked the sticky as you did.

the intent here is to HELP and EDUCATE, not belittle and Irritate - please remember that.

I will. Sorry. Belittling was NOT my intent, although after re-reading the thread, I do appear to be caustic.

What I find that helps is to remember the really dumb things I've done myself, through a lack of knowledge

Ok, although I also remember, sometimes I received the same response as I gave here. No excuse. Just fact. I'm none for the worse for it, but I'll refrain from now on Steve.
Freddie, Excuse my misaligned intent. Old fart syndrome I guess. I should have said nothing. Good luck with your project.
fitZ

knightfly · Post by **knightfly** » Sat Mar 26, 2005 1:08 am

Freddy, you got lucky; had you not put insulation in those corners they would have caused problems with the room's response as mentioned.

If, in the future, you find you need to add bass trapping to the room (pretty likely) you could just cut wooden grilles into the bottoms and tops of those 45's and let all that insulation work for you in another way, depending on how they were filled and how MUCH they were filled... Steve

vocomotion · Post by **vocomotion** » Sat Mar 26, 2005 5:08 am

Steve,

Yeah, the corners are STUFFED with 3" Thermafiber. We had a few extra bags, so I had the guys stuff the corners full of it. I see what you're saying, basically make these into permanently built-in bass traps. Makes sense.

Thanks for your help!
--> freddie

knightfly · Post by **knightfly** » Sat Mar 26, 2005 10:29 am

Right; if you do that, remember that highest pressures are nearest intersections; in the case of those 45's, moreso at top and bottom. So that's where the "vents" should go... Steve