Home basement tracking and rehearsing room

[floydfan92]

Hello everybody !
I'm new here but i've read this forum for quite a bit to search for some infos (lots and lots of great suggestion here , it's really an awesome forum)
The reason why I decided to join you it's because I've finally decided to build my own tracking/rehearsing room which will be used by all my family and my bandmates . I'm still studying at university here in Italy but i've always wanted to work with music and get some "practice" with studio and live recording .

All this project isn't meant to become a recording business , i'd like just to do things the best way i can and not rush everything.
I uploaded some (poor) 3d and 2d plans as well some photos of the inside and outside area and datasheets of some prdoucts i'd like to use.

As you can see everything will be built inside a concrete basement with decent thick main walls. According to the plan and since for isolation mass is the key , I'll build inner walls made of a special acoustic concrete-like bricks (data in pdf , they're called laterite) and a drywall (15mm)/greenglue/drywall sandwich ( previously i was aiming at Sheetblock from auralex but here i got many infos about its worse price/effectivness ratio ....and this GG is really great for the price ! ) and everything built 12to15 cm off the main walls, everything floated on special iso rubber (i know about engaging it with the right weight and what have been discussed here , but since the walls will be pretty heavy and those pads/liner is studied to float concrete walls , i guess i'm pretty set ) and , if useful , the empty space filled (how moch or if any at all?) with rockwool ending up just like a two leaf construction made of concrete walls.

The floor was initially meant to be "floating" made with u-boats and all that , but after reading many posts about the need of such floating ( the real ones made of concrete) I gave up not wanting to create a resonating drumhead ..so...I was searching for something like Copopren or JCW impactalay as layer under the usual sandwich+plywood+laminated floor... The real issue here is avalible height ... bare room is 2.65meters high and i don't want to get less than 2.4/2.45 meters with the final room and going with that awesome room mode calculator the best usage of the space according to somewhat good ratio is 1:1.5:2.5 (if I remember well , the final measures i thought will be 6x3.6x2.45 (giving just a problem around 460-470hz and so on)
I made a concrete base ( thickness varies from 5 to 15 cm) which touches, unfortunately , in a small area around the top right corner , like 3/4 up from bottom the wall's "foot" .
The ceiling will be made using elastic suspensions , dw/GG/dw and 5cm air space filled with rockwool.


This is a little summary of what my and my father's idea is . Any suggestions ? Am I doing all wrong ? How would you do things ? I'm really a newbie (only 20yrs old) so I'm really opened to different ways of doing this so my little dream would come true.

Cheers from Italy
Alessandro

PS. I don't need all that isolation to allow me to play at full blast at 2:00 am ( laws sets 40dB as a maximum noise in residential areas ..even though i have a disco which on saturdays and sundays night rises it to 55-65dB measured by myself at 4.00am) .. just the most i can get out of this place .
PPS. the drums and bass amp will be placed on isolation risers ( i've seen a really great plan on this forum) but i think most of the times we will be playing trough stereo headphones monitor (i'm buying a Behringer X32 that will be the core of the studio) so bass guitar will be routed trough a good DI.


LINKS
Laterite http://www.prefedil.it/index.php?option ... &Itemid=51
http://www.prefedil.it/images/stories/l ... rativa.pdf
http://www.prefedil.it/images/stories/l ... ficati.pdf
http://www.prefedil.it/images/stories/PDF/Laterite.pdf
http://www.prefedil.it/index.php?option ... &Itemid=46
http://www.prefedil.it/index.php?option ... &Itemid=27 (how to use)

JCW Impactalay http://www.acoustic-supplies.com/produc ... talay-plus
Copropen http://www.masacoustics.it/Isolamento-A ... e.tpl.html

Elastic Suspensions http://www.masacoustics.it/Isolamento-A ... dotti.html

[floydfan92]

here some photos of the outside area

[floydfan92]

The "hole" in the ceiling/pavement will be almost certainly closed with glass bricks or some kind of heavy shutter to let air flow around what will be the studio building ...any suggestion will be highly appreciated .
The concrete step (with all the plumbing ) will accomodate the air system ( a "non split" air conditioner) and isobox for the air flow. The according wall will be like 2-3 cm from that step , so not flush to the existing concrete.
The covered drain is to evacuate any possible water in excess ( rain infiltrations from the soil ) thanks to a pump

[floydfan92]

Nobody ? no tips/suggestions nor warnings ? Are there any other informations you'd need ?
I'd really like to start building the studio in the next few weeks and get it complete by the summer

[Soundman2020]

Hi there "floydfan92", and welcome!!!

Sorry about the delay! Busy forum, too few hours in the day...

As you can see everything will be built inside a concrete basement with decent thick main walls.

That's a really good starting point! So those will be your outer-leaf walls.

I'll build inner walls made of a special acoustic concrete-like bricks (data in pdf , they're called laterite) and a drywall (15mm)/greenglue/drywall sandwich

Why? With an outer-leaf of concrete, and an inner-leaf of drywall (15mm)/greenglue/drywall, that's all you need. What is the reason for also wanting to use that "laterite" product? According to the link, it is actually lighter than drywall, and it seems rather complicated to install. What additional benefit are you hoping for by adding that to the sandwich?

everything floated on special iso rubber (i know about engaging it with the right weight and what have been discussed here , but since the walls will be pretty heavy and those pads/liner is studied to float concrete walls , i guess i'm pretty set

You are only "pretty well set" if you do the math, and it works out to the right answer! Guessing is not a good idea. You need to know the actual characteristics of the rubber, the optimal deflection, and the load that will get you that deflection. Then you can figure out the load of the walls, and based on that, figure out how many square cm of rubber you need under each part of the wall, in order to get the right deflection...

and , if useful , the empty space filled (how moch or if any at all?

You mean the cavity between the concrete outer-leaf and the drywall inner-leaf? Yes, that MUST have insulation in it. At least 10cm. The insulation must be 50 kg/m3 for mineral wool, or 30 kg/m3 for fiberglass.

The floor was initially meant to be "floating" made with u-boats and all that , but after reading many posts about the need of such floating ( the real ones made of concrete) I gave up not wanting to create a resonating drumhead

Excellent! Very smart move!

I was searching for something like Copopren or JCW impactalay as layer under the usual sandwich+plywood+laminated floor

I'm not sure what you mean: Why do you need a "sandwich" and also "plywood"? You have a concrete floor: that's all you need! Put down plain foam underlay, then put the laminate floor in that. End. Done. Nothing else required. The only problem would be if the concrete is in bad shape, uneven cracked, or not level, in which case you fix that with a thin layer of self-leveling cement (a few mm), then put the underlay down, then the laminate. But you do not need a "sandwich" or "plywood"!

But from the photos, your floor seems to be in great condition, so you probably don't even need that leveling cement.

The real issue here is avalible height ... bare room is 2.65meters high and i don't want to get less than 2.4/2.45 meters

Laminate flooring is usually about 8mm to 15mm thick. The underlay is another 3mm (or maybe 5mm). So your entire floor will not take up more than 2cm, maximum. So your ceiling height will go down from 2.65 m to 2.63m....

The ceiling will be made using elastic suspensions

Do you have a link to the product you are planning in using for that?

dw/GG/dw and 5cm air space filled with rockwool

5cm air gap is not enough. You need AT LEAST 10 cm, or the MSM resonance will be too high.

But even then, with a 10 cm air gap and two layers of 16mm drywall, you still only lose 13 cm in ceiling height. So now it goes down from 2.63 to 2.5. Still fine!


- Stuart -

[floydfan92]

Thanks Soundman2020
About the inner leaf , there are actually 4 types of laterite , 3 standard ones ( 5 , 7.5 , 10 cm) and a special one aimed at isolating sound called "fonoisolante" which comes only in 7.5cm thickness and weighs 22kg per panel (70x28.5x7.5) . I just checked 15mm drywall and it says 12kg/m^2 more or less , whereas that special laterite is 110kg/m^2 (even if we put together 5 layers of 15mm drywall it goes for 60-65kg/m^2 maximum ) .. Am I doing something wrong with maths ?

http://www.masacoustics.it/Isolamento-A ... e.tpl.html
http://www.masacoustics.it/Isolamento-A ... e.tpl.html
The above links are for the ceiling suspensions

For the floor , what kind of foam underlay are you referring to ? Would you mind to post a link of something that would do the trick ? I have this in mind http://www.masacoustics.it/Isolamento-A ... e.tpl.html but it's 4cm thick !

Thanks again !