TIE LINES IN WALLS/CAULKING

Need recommendations for running tie lines in/through walls (framing is up, no rock hung yet). Also, where do I get soundproofing caulk that isn't $7-8 a tube? Your help is appreciated!

If you're using jack plates on opposite walls, I'd offset them by at least one, preferably two, stud cavities - caulk in place (with a few extra wires brought into the boxes), caulk each thru-hole in the studs before rocking on the second side, and caulk every possible hole in boxes and around between box and rock. Not knowing your knowledge level yet, I'd add a warning NOT to run AC power within a couple feet of, or parallel to, any audio lines. If you already knew this, don't read this paragraph :? Adding a Cat5 patch setup couldn't hurt either - it can run digital audio in a pinch, plus you can control a DAW from any room there's a Cat5 link, with a couple of extender boxes. Just a thought, especially if you're a "one-man band... $7-8 per LARGE, 29-32 oz tube of acoustic caulk is typical web prices, but locally $4 gets reported consistently in some areas, by going to Commercial DRywall/insulation contractors. Some are helpful, some not. What general area are you located? You might check the materials forum here and see if anyone's posted prices/availability for your area... Steve

Thanks for the response. (I'm in the upper midwest...) Should I run the wires through some kind of tubing through the studs to the wall jacks and stuff it with insulation once the tie lines are run through? I'd like the option of removing/adding wires if necessary (I'll be running a snake to start). Can you tell me more about the Cat5 patch? Finally, Markertek has 29 oz. sound sealant tubes for $7.39-are there better options? P.S. THIS FORUM ROCKS! (pun intended! :D :D )

Upper midwest? I am in michigan it qualifies, so does Minnesota, be more specific so we can direct you to a place. Bryan Giles

Depending on how much isolation you need, you could run a fairly large conduit thru the walls - you'd need at least two 90 degree bends and some custom caps (modified from stock) and some insulation for stuffing - you'd make it the next size bigger than the biggest connector bundle you hope to stuff through it, so you wouldn't have to re-solder 28 ends of a snake. I've drawn such things before, but apparently didn't save them - I'll have to re-draw, so the details may take a day or two but I'll post back. For DAW remote control, go to pricewatch.com, and type the words cat5 extender into their search box. It should bring up units by Belkin and one or two others I don't recall. What you're looking for has two "boxes", one for each end - they have hookups for keyboard, monitor and mouse. you can run several hundred feet of Category 5 computer cable between them (one system even includes something like 500 feet of cable) - Then, search the words cat5 patchbay, and you'll find small (8 or 12) input patchbays - they have the same connectors a network interface card has, called RJ-45 - If you put a single connector in each room other than the control room, and the patch bay in the control room, you can patch the extender in the control room to any room in the facility and hook up the other box to its corresponding wall plate in (for example) the vocal booth - Finally, you'd need a small LCD monitor, keyboard and mouse and maybe a portable stand (like for large remote controls in a CR) to set these on, and you can control any function of your DAW from the vocal booth. If you have one of the newer digital mixers and the right software, you may even be able to control the mixer from a booth using MMC. When putting this all together, you need to watch for protocol compatibility - make sure you get an extender that matches the type of keyboard/monitor/mouse you have. Some newer stuff is USB, others are older standards with DB-15 for monitor, Din plug for keyboard, and 9-pin serial for mouse. The cool thing about this setup is that you now have the option of flying "solo" or using the facility in normal ways, with nothing compromised either way. Do the above research if you're interested, and come back with whatever new questions that brings up. Meantime, I'll work on a drawing for wall feed-throughs for temp wiring. Oh, on the caulk - that price is about the best you'll find on the web, but locally people report prices around $4 a tube. Bryan's fairly close to your area, and has gotten some good deals... Steve

A little more info on the extenders - http://catalog.belkin.com/IWCatProductP ... t_Id=87618 And here's a real-world price http://www.pcnation.com/asp/details.asp?item=151225 And another for USB - http://store.yahoo.com/geminicomputersi ... ce700.html And a patch panel - http://store.yahoo.com/pctekonline/bafel12porca.html The single Cat5 wall setups are available at Home Depot's, at least in my area... Steve

THANKS!! All this info is so much appreciated! (I'm in Minnesota-Twin Cities) Hoping to find some place to pick up sound proofing caulk much cheaper. Knightfly if you have the time to post the pix of the wall conduit that would really help!! Next I'd like to find a dealer for the Roxul AFB batts... THANKS AGAIN! :D :D

Call local Commercial Drywall/insulation places - some will be helpful, some not, just like anywhere else. Any luck should get you the 29 oz tubes for around $4 each. Drawing may take a day or two, I'm on 12-hour night shifts for a few... Steve

OK, now for the bad news - try as I might, I've not been able to come up with a thru-wall design that wouldn't nearly destroy the isolation of the wall. The idea I mentioned earlier is one I dreamed up a few years ago and never built - my studies in the last few years have shown me why it wouldn't work. I think that rather than ruin the isolation of your walls, you'd be happier putting multi-conductor snake cable thru the wall and caulking it in place, offsetting in-out points by a couple of studs and leaving extra wires in place. Doing jack plates on both sides and caulking them well would do the least to compromise your construction. Sorry if I got your hopes up on this, but physics just aren't cooperating... Steve

There are a ton of builder's supply houses in the Min/St. Paul Area. Best bet is to call them up and ask for acoustical sealent. Having no Idea what side of town you are on, I could not research it better, but do a yellowpages.net search and type in builder supply. Bryan Giles

Once again you guys are really helpful! I'm taking all of your great recommendations into account and will post my results when it's finally done! Thanks!!

DON'T PLAN ANY TYPE OF REMOVEABLE WIRE RUN! You will need to realize you need to vary BOTH the run's height and width...that is, at each leaf the hole should be up/down moved a foot or two left or right from the previous opening. Therefore, "snaking" thru the walls will eat up a lot of cabling! It's very important to have several extra lines. Just to give you my example, I started with 26 lines of Canare Star Quad 15 feet long (not cheap). By the time I snaked thru the double walls and air space, I had 5 feet left to reach the console!! Hope this helps.

I found this on the Markertek web site for $3.80USD when I did a serch for Caulk. Is this Acoustic Caulk?

MSK-1 Markertek Markerstik Acoustical Foam Adhesive Flexible foam adhesive to install urethane foams to all types of wall paneling, wood, plywood, cardboard, metal and concrete. Each tube will mount up to 50 square feet.

If not, does any one have a favorite place on line to buy acoustic caulk or know of any one in the LA area that sells it? I have called tons of contractors with no luck at all.

No, unfortunately that's just the glue to mount their acoustic foam to the wall with - not all glues are compatible with foam (some will eat it for breakfast) You might PM Lee (Laptoppop) - he's in the LA area and just finished a cool room - if either of you think of it, please post your sources in the Building Materials forum. What you're looking for is usually called Acoustic Sealant, sometimes called Acoustic-rated caulk. It's usually heavier bodied and ALWAYS non-hardening. Any caulk that hardens, will eventually crack and de-rate your wall performance for sound isolation... Steve

The acoustic caulks are also often refered to as "floppy caulks" - when fully cured they have a very VERY pliable body - you can make quite an indentation in them even years after they set - and they very slowly return to the original shape......... There are a lot of caulks that won't harden over the years - for example - Sika-Flex manufactured by Sika - however the density of the caulk exceeds that of acoustical caulk after setting........ So don't get sucked into bying something just because it doesn't "harden" and crack over the years........ Just a thought, Rod

rod gervais wrote:

The acoustic caulks are also often refered to as "floppy caulks" - when fully cured they have a very VERY pliable body - you can make quite an indentation in them even years after they set - and they very slowly return to the original shape......... There are a lot of caulks that won't harden over the years - for example - Sika-Flex manufactured by Sika - however the density of the caulk exceeds that of acoustical caulk after setting........ So don't get sucked into bying something just because it doesn't "harden" and crack over the years........ Just a thought, Rod

Rod, do you happen to know which Sika-flex product (they have many) is the one suitable for use as acoustic caulk? I'm having an unbelievable heck of a time trying to find acoustic caulk here in Germany. A trillion thanks, Dingo