7x10x11 Basement Design: Finished Design, questions remain..

All, First off, hello all. I am a new comer here and just purchased a new house of which I would like to convert part of my basement to a recording studio. That being said, I would like advice as to where in my basement would make the best place to build my studio. The actual studio design and how-to questions will come after I learn where in my basement to design my studio. Ideally I would like to place the recording both in the upper right hind corner of the picture I've posted below where the closet is. The ceiling are about 7' high, but the darker grey section in my sketch depicts where the ceiling drops about a foot for air ducts and such... With this odd shaped basement I would like to know where the most promising place to build my control room would be (assuming the closet I've mentioned previously is where the recording booth would be, but am also willing to build the recording booth elsewhere if needbe. I choose this location because the ceiling of this closet is solid brick while the rest of the walls & ceiling in the basement are drywall...). Also, the closet in the middle of the basement is unoccupied so I am also willing to remove that entirely if needbe.. Lastly, I made this sketch with SketchUp so everything is pretty close to scale (off by quarters & half inches as I had difficulty getting the exact sizes in SketchUp being a first time user..). Also, the floor of this basement is concreate with a linoleum surface...

How about something like this cheers john

Thanks John! The only question I have is this - Will the lowered ceilings in the booth be a problem?

UPDATE: I've gutted out the upper righthand closet and verified it is solid brick so John's original design (above) won't work which has left me to the design posted previously as well as those questions. If Brick isn't ideal for a recording booth then perhaps I can do something like this (first design below..), or incorporate both design (this one and the one after it..) and have two recording booths?)... Thanx all! - GAPE C H I C A G O Ps. My humble appologies for not getting it right the first time as I had no idea that closet was beneath the porch leading to solid brick walls and a cement ceiling there... =(

design 4 looks the best layout to me. cheers john

Thanx much for your time John.. - GAPE C H I C A G O

Hello all! After several months of bad luck (house broken into..) I am happy to say that I am back on my feet and able to continue my studio design! Since we left off I've continued reading when I could and continued using my newly aquired knowledge to continue with my studio design. That being said, here is the design I would like to go with. I would love for any and all to comment freely on the cons of this design as well as input as to how to remedy those cons... BACKGROUND: I will be recording HipHop, Rap, and R&B FLOORS are concrete with tile/linoleum CEILING is drywall and only about 7" high EXISTING WALLS are drywall stuffed with insolation and brick or concrete behind that. NEW WALLS to be put up will be as follows: 1/2" Drywall + 1/2" Drywall + 2x6stud frame (2x6s on bottom & top) + 1/2" Drywall + RC-25 (on side facing Control Room) + 1/2" Drywall Here are some questions I have also.. Q1: I'm basing my design off of the 1:1.28:1.54 ratio. my available space is 7'x10.5'x11.5' which I translated to approximaitely 7'x9'x11' i.e. 7' ceilings, walls slayed at 6-degrees with the shorter wall at 8' and the longer wall at 10', length is 11'. NOTE: The total length will be 11' and not the length of the slayed walls as depicted in my pic below.. NOTE: The total width of the shorter wall will be 8' and NOT 9' as depicted in my pic below.. Is this even correct? Q2: Since the existing walls are standard drywall on 2x4s stuffed with insolation then brick or concrete behind that, can I get away with not building any of the walls labelled WALL "X" and using the existing walls of the house or will I get better accoustics putting up all the walls in my design? Q3: If I'm better off putting up all the walls in my design, what do I do about the space between the new walls I put up and the existing walls already there as there will be minimal space between them? Q4: Due to the low, barely 7' ceiling, I don't plan on raising the floors nor adjusting the ceilings. Instead I simply plan on laying carpetting down over the existing concrete-then-linoleum floors. Is this the best route to go or what else can I do to treat the floors? Q5: I don't care about retaining sound in my studio as noise is not an issue. That being said, I'm I better off insolation any walls I put up, or is simply leaving them un-insolated the way to go? Please comment freely on anything I might have over looked or any part of my design that simply wont work. Regards & looking forward to your responses.. - GAPE C H I C A G O

Hello again all. What am I missing here that I have yet to receive any types of replies? Regards & patiently waiting... - GAPE C H I C A G O

All, I've cleaned up my post as it looked a bit confusing with all my old, incorrect designs and such so now it only has info that is current in hopes to get further feed back from all of you regarding my design and remaining questions.. Also, I have 12/23/06 thru 1/1/07 off so I'm hoping to be able to start construction during that time.. Regards & thanx yet again in advance..

GapeOne wrote:

Q1: I'm basing my design off of the 1:1.28:1.54 ratio. my available space is 7'x10.5'x11.5' which I translated to approximaitely 7'x9'x11'

small but if the ratio is close, you're probably ok from that standpoint. with angled walls the room modes are not removed, just changed. the real challenge will be the small space.

GapeOne wrote:

Q2: Since the existing walls are standard drywall on 2x4s stuffed with insolation then brick or concrete behind that, can I get away with not building any of the walls labelled WALL "X" and using the existing walls of the house or will I get better accoustics putting up all the walls in my design?

see below.

GapeOne wrote:

Q3: If I'm better off putting up all the walls in my design, what do I do about the space between the new walls I put up and the existing walls already there as there will be minimal space between them?

on the walls with the concrete wall opposite - you don't need the additional wall, just the air gap. in fact you could use 2x4 walls and keep the gap the same - the gap is really measured wall to wall not stud to stud. Rod's Gervais's book can really explain the construction details so I recommend getting a copy.

GapeOne wrote:

Q4: Due to the low, barely 7' ceiling, I don't plan on raising the floors nor adjusting the ceilings. Instead I simply plan on laying carpetting down over the existing concrete-then-linoleum floors. Is this the best route to go or what else can I do to treat the floors?

i'd say try small carpets to break up reflections and some absorption on the ceiling (opposite the carpets) so you can keep some life in the room but treat for flutter echos.

GapeOne wrote:

Q5: I don't care about retaining sound in my studio as noise is not an issue. That being said, I'm I better off insolation any walls I put up, or is simply leaving them un-insolated the way to go?

I'd insulate them regardless since it will help dampen the wall resonance.

Thanks for the reply! I was out sick yesterday or else I would've just as eagerly replied then.. :D

gullfo wrote:

small but if the ratio is close, you're probably ok from that standpoint. with angled walls the room modes are not removed, just changed. the real challenge will be the small space.

I agree, but that's the space I have to work with so the plan is to put up the studio as designed then make a second pass to remedy any additional accustic issues that arise once I've used the studio a bit. Is this a good plan of attack?

gullfo wrote:

on the walls with the concrete wall opposite - you don't need the additional wall, just the air gap. in fact you could use 2x4 walls and keep the gap the same - the gap is really measured wall to wall not stud to stud.

You sort of lost me on the "walls with the concrete wall opposite" line as I have no idea what you meant by that so I've relabelled my drawing in hopes that you'll clarify that comment. See the newly labelled walls below..

gullfo wrote:

Rod's Gervais's book can really explain the construction details so I recommend getting a copy.

I will definitely do so! Thanks. What is the actual title of the book as I plan to hit Borders after work today (and order it if they don't have it in stock..).

gullfo wrote:

i'd say try small carpets to break up reflections and some absorption on the ceiling (opposite the carpets) so you can keep some life in the room but treat for flutter echos.

Thanks for the input. Just one more question here: When you say "opposite the carpets" do you mean inverted from what was done with the carpets or to simply replicate what is on the floor on the ceiling so that I can stand on a piece of carpet put my hand on the ceiling directly above it and touch absorption?

gullfo wrote:

I'd insulate them regardless since it will help dampen the wall resonance.

I will go ahead and do so, but can you clarify the following for me... I thought a wall with no insulation would create a bigger air gap in the wall which would increase it's overall STC? What am I missing here? Thanx in advance!

Aloha, Rod's book: Home Recording Studio: Build it Like the Pros http://www.amazon.com/o/ASIN/1598630342 ... pe_snp_342 Aloha 8)

kendale wrote:

Aloha, Rod's book: Home Recording Studio: Build it Like the Pros http://www.amazon.com/o/ASIN/1598630342 ... pe_snp_342 Aloha 8)

Aloha! Thanx for the link Kendale. I went ahead and ordered it online. Also paid for the extra shipping to verify I get it within the next 3-5 business days.. Regards,

NOTE: carried this over from the previous page as to not let it get lost in the shuffle of answered posts... Thanks for the reply! I was out sick yesterday or else I would've just as eagerly replied then.. :D

gullfo wrote:

small but if the ratio is close, you're probably ok from that standpoint. with angled walls the room modes are not removed, just changed. the real challenge will be the small space.

I agree, but that's the space I have to work with so the plan is to put up the studio as designed then make a second pass to remedy any additional accustic issues that arise once I've used the studio a bit. Is this a good plan of attack?

gullfo wrote:

on the walls with the concrete wall opposite - you don't need the additional wall, just the air gap. in fact you could use 2x4 walls and keep the gap the same - the gap is really measured wall to wall not stud to stud.

You sort of lost me on the "walls with the concrete wall opposite" line as I have no idea what you meant by that so I've relabelled my drawing in hopes that you'll clarify that comment. See the newly labelled walls below..

gullfo wrote:

Rod's Gervais's book can really explain the construction details so I recommend getting a copy.

Thanx to Kendale's link above I already ordered it! 8)

gullfo wrote:

i'd say try small carpets to break up reflections and some absorption on the ceiling (opposite the carpets) so you can keep some life in the room but treat for flutter echos.

Thanks for the input. Just one more question here: When you say "opposite the carpets" do you mean inverted from what was done with the carpets or to simply replicate what is on the floor on the ceiling so that I can stand on a piece of carpet put my hand on the ceiling directly above it and touch absorption?

gullfo wrote:

I'd insulate them regardless since it will help dampen the wall resonance.

I will go ahead and do so, but can you clarify the following for me... I thought a wall with no insulation would create a bigger air gap in the wall which would increase it's overall STC? What am I missing here? Thanx in advance!

Aloha,

I thought a wall with no insulation would create a bigger air gap in the wall which would increase it's overall STC? What am I missing here?

If I remember correctly, and the technique has not become outdated, I seem to remember reading somewhere around here that insulation (703, rockwool @ pcf 2.5) is still considered "air." Perhaps a search would bring more light to the subject,yes? :wink: Aloha 8)

Thanx yet again Kendale! I will do some further reading regarding this to learn a bit more about it.. Now if someone could come along and answer the rest of my questions I'd be a happy camper.. :P

if you're constructing an inner wall opposite the concrete or block one, the air gap is the distance from the sheetrock to the cement wall, so a 2x4 stud + 1" gap will be 4.5" and that should be fine along with insulation to dampen the sheetrock wall. make sure the insulation does not touch the block/cement wall since you want an air gap there or things can get moldy pretty quickly... i think you new design - facing the window is good - but you're still space constrained so its really a matter of deciding how you'll use the space you have. even without the angled walls, you could treat a smal rectagular room so its good enough. the carpets on the floor would cover hard surfaces alternating with the ceiling treatment. (alternating was the word my feeble brain was looking for the other day...) this way you keep some life in the room and reduce the flutter echos...

gullfo wrote:

if you're constructing an inner wall opposite the concrete or block one, the air gap is the distance from the sheetrock to the cement wall, so a 2x4 stud + 1" gap will be 4.5" and that should be fine along with insulation to dampen the sheetrock wall. make sure the insulation does not touch the block/cement wall since you want an air gap there or things can get moldy pretty quickly...

Glenn, Thanx again for the reply. I do greatly appreciate you taking the time. Now, I've understood everything else you mentioned, but would like to re-iterate the new walls to to verify I understand completely what you are describing. I understand how the air gap is measured. What I am confused about is your choice of the term OPPOSITE. Anyway, here goes... I am assuming you trully mean inner LEAFs instead of walls? Meaning I can take the existing block/cement wall and use that as the outer leaf of my new wall then add a 2x4 stud (as the frame) and then an inner leaf (sheetrock) to it? Then insolate that with the insolation resting against the sheetrock and not the existing wall? Perhaps my picture below will better explain what I think you mean, but please tell me if I'm way off on this.. Also, the block/cement wall is not bare. It too has a 2x4 stud (frame) in front of it then finished with drywall (also insolated). I believe I mentioned this previously. I've included what the existing walls trully are beneath the drywall finish (basement IS finished) in my picture below also (right side of the wall in grey). That being said, will the existing walls not being bare, block/cement walls be a problem regarding using them as outter leaves of my new walls as you suggest? What I was thinking (and this is because of the existing walls and how they are Drywall+2x4+block/cement that is insolated..) was to simply add another sheet of drywall & RC to the existing wall so that the new wall constructions would look more like picture 2 I've included...

Hi GapeOne As i read in your post, isolation (sounds going out) of the studio is not a concern right ? Here's the thing. You may want to build a studio from wich sounds escape and it's fine with me, BUT what you don't (usually) want is a studio with a poor separation between the Control room and the Booth\ studio. And to my knowledge there is just no shortcuts to get there, it's just one of those things you just can't do halfway and still have great results. If you are not decoupling your walls from the bulding walls and ceiling from the floor above you are loosing huge amout of separation between your booth and CR, due to mechanical transmission / flanking path. Maybe you're already aware of all that and my appologies if ti's just old news to you. Some suggestion for your existing basements walls If you are thigt on budget : Tear up the drywalls at CR and booth location and put RC channels, since Those two leaves share the same frame make sure that both leaves are not coupled, independent RC and a gap in the drywall. Hope this is clear enough. :? Better : Tear up the drywalls at CR and booth location and build another frame. any option you choose then Do a double frame construction for the rest with a minimum of two layer of 5/8 drywall on each walls (greenglue inbetween if you can ) and Rockwool in the walls cavities slightly pressed. Caulk every gaps and seams, corner and be generous.

I think your #2 diagram is correct in how to address the outer walls. by opposite or opposing walls within the same wall configuration is my meaning. Eric has the right ideas on isolation between the CR and booth/live room.

i Should also add that in both walls sugestion you posted, if i understand your graph correcly the RC channels are placed in between two layer of drywall don't do that. Place RC channel direcly on the wall frame then put all drywall on it. See my previous post. I agree with gulfo, design #2 is a better option (exept for the placement of RC channels). Merry chrismas