New Studio

Hey guys! This is my 1st post, so I'll catch you up on what's been going on in the following replies below...

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Now for some outside digital camera photos... Taken about 2.5 months ago (newer photos will be posted after this reply) (they will make more sense if you've looked at the photo and read my text in my reply above) ...also, I have placed a small map in the lower left-hand corner to show where I was standing when I took the photograph. south side... parking lot... camera facing north - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - south-east side... parking lot...camera facing north-west - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - south-east side (more east)... camera facing north-west (more west) - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - east side... camera facing west - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - north-east side (more east)... camera facing south-west (more west) - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - north-east side... camera facing south-west (standing in gas station) - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - north-east corner... camera facing east (between studio & car wash, more toward car wash) - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - north-east corner... camera facing east (inside car wash exit) - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - East side of car wash (betwenn car wash & studio)... camera facing studio (south-east) > - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - East side of car wash (betwenn car wash & studio)... camera facing studio (south-east... more east) > - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - East side of car wash (betwenn car wash & studio)... camera facing studio (south-east... more east, & upward) - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - East side of car wash (betwenn car wash & studio)... camera facing studio (south-east... more east) - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Camera location is north-east of the studio, close to the main street, facing north-west. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Camera location is on the corner of the main street just past the gas station, facing the studio (south-west) - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Camera location is on the south-east corner of the studio, facing north-west. > - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Camera location is on the north-east corner of the studio, facing south-west. >

Here's a layout of the new studio (empty, as it is right now)... Here's a preliminary layout of how the studio might end up... [size=0].[/size]

I did some sound level meter tests. I need to do it again when the traffic is heavier... Outside (4 feet from window): maximum = 93dB(C) 83dB(A) average = 82dB(C) 80dB(A) minimum = 60dB(C) 57dB(A)

The nest step... - Remove the windows & hollow metal window frame - Put in a wood 2x4 frame - Install T&G on the outside to match the rest of the building - Fill the inside of thr frame will drywall - Add additional layers of drywall over the frame The plan (in more detail)... Outside Tung & Groove Plywood Wood Stud Frame (with the following filling, to match thickness of block wall underneith) 1/2" drywall GreenGlue 5/8" drywall GreenGlue 1/2" drywall GreenGlue 5/8" drywall GreenGlue 5/8" drywall (from floor to ceiling) GreenGlue MLV (from floor to ceiling) GreenGlue 1/2" drywall (from floor to ceiling) GreenGlue 5/8" drywall (from floor to ceiling) This is to completely fill the outside wall (the space where the windows were) with mass, and to be sure that all gaps are sealed. A second wall will be built later. PS: I already have the MLV. If I knew better when I bought it I wouldn't have, but now that I have it I need to find a good place to put it. However, it does seem to have excellent low frequency rejection, so it may be a good thing.

As you can see from the photos below... the windows and window frame have been removed. The rectangular holes in the frame you see on the inside photos will be filled with layers of 5/8" drywall (with green-glue between them, and acoustic-caulk around the endges) to get the same (or better) mass as the concrete brick wall below.

- T&G has been installed and painted... - Various cracks have been sealed... - Layers (5) of 5/8" drywall being installed within frame (w/ greenglue between & acoustic caulk around edges)...

So that;s where I am (as of 2 weeks ago;) ...I'll take new photos tommorow. I'll have some questions for you guys, and I'm looking forward to reading everyone elses topics... :) A happy new member of the forum,Dan

Wow, that's a MEAN first post; welcome, Dan; acoustically, looks like you have a good start on a serious m-a-m system. I'm wondering, though, what you're doing for vapor barrier - where, what, how? Would you say that your location has more "cooling" days than "heating" days, or vice versa? That will be the main factor in determining vapor barrier location, I only hope we're not too late. If you air condition more than you heat, that barrier should be just under your outer skin to avoid moisture problems within your wall. Also, do you plan on separate dehumidification, or is your location dry enough year 'round not to need it? Do you really want your rooms having all those parallel surfaces and what appears to be nearly SQUARE dimensions? I've seen some of your questions over at studiotips on staggered studs, etc - when building separate frames this won't get you more than maybe 1 or 2 dB at most, and this is just my gut feel - for interior walls, it would be a royal pain to do this because it immediately stops you from being able to "walk thru the walls" during construction, and makes everything else more difficult than it's worth. If you check out the REFERENCE section there's one link there to some terms/definitions, I also saw that you weren't sure how the "air gap" in a m-a-m wall is defined, unless that's already been answered for you. By your A vs. C weighted readings, it sounds like you have somewhat of a LF rumble problem (typical for traffic) - do you plan on floating your floors/inner rooms, or something else? Don't remember if that was you asking about isolated vs. floating slabs. Also, have you decided on a value for the total air gap between outer leaf and inner yet? Sounds like you should be shooting for a TL of around 40 dB @ 50 hZ if you want the low end of your traffic noise inaudible; that will take quite a bit of mass (good start already) damping (hooray for GG) and air gap. Do you have dimensions of your existing raw space somewhere? If so, I missed 'em, sorry. 'bout all I have time for ATM, again Welcome... Steve

Hi Steve! And thanks for the warm welcome :)

knightfly wrote:

Do you really want your rooms having all those parallel surfaces and what appears to be nearly SQUARE dimensions?

Well, nothing is square. I carefully checked the room modes and got them space very far appart. As for the parallel surfaces, I don't really want them, but I fear that my contractor will screw up the integrity and isolation during construction if I make lots of angled walls. My plan was to angle all the ceilings (the live room ceiling and the control room ceiling), completely cover the walls and ceiling in the control room with absorbtion (plus some diffusion), cover the back wall of the live room with absorbtion, and completely cover the front wall, side walls, and ceiling of the live room with various types of diffusors.

knightfly wrote:

I've seen some of your questions over at studiotips on staggered studs, etc - when building separate frames this won't get you more than maybe 1 or 2 dB at most, and this is just my gut feel - for interior walls, it would be a royal pain to do this because it immediately stops you from being able to "walk thru the walls" during construction, and makes everything else more difficult than it's worth.

What would you recommend? Build up the walls up with some serious number of layers instead of building each room as a separate and isolated entity?

knightfly wrote:

If you check out the REFERENCE section there's one link there to some terms/definitions, I also saw that you weren't sure how the "air gap" in a m-a-m wall is defined, unless that's already been answered for you.

I think it makes sense to me now. My post over on StudioTips was regarding how to calculate the resonant frequency of an air-gap. However, I'm still not sure how to calculate the effects of mass on each side of the wall, in regards to how it changes the resonant frequency.

knightfly wrote:

By your A vs. C weighted readings, it sounds like you have somewhat of a LF rumble problem (typical for traffic)

The outside of the building has a 3-4 foot high dirt planter perimeter around the concrete foundation. Because of this, I figured that outside noise going through the contrete foundation won't be a major problem (however, I am worried about flanking from the live room into the control room and vise-versa). My plan was to put down a layer or two of gypsum (if 2 layers, green glue between them) on the floor, then put a rubber flooring on top of that, with parkay wood floor on top of that (carpet instead of parkay in the control room). What do you think?

knightfly wrote:

Also, have you decided on a value for the total air gap between outer leaf and inner yet? Sounds like you should be shooting for a TL of around 40 dB @ 50 hZ if you want the low end of your traffic noise inaudible; that will take quite a bit of mass (good start already) damping (hooray for GG) and air gap.

I'm doing lots of research and learning about that. It seems that the ultimate would be an 11inch gap (that number includes the space between the studs filled with insulation). It's just big enough to allow the resonant frequency to be well below 30Hz (recording a down-tuned acoustic bass would be excellent!). But that calculation is for walls with only two layers of drywall on each side (not 3 on one side and more than 5 on the other, and hardly takes greenglue into acount or the layer of MLV). Thanks Steve