Stucco as mass?

7 bucks for 3 29oz tubes Man, that's about the cheapest I've ever seen; what brand is it, and could you post that info in the Building Products forum? Pleeze, Pleeze, thank you... Steve

The tube says: Miracle SCS-100 Sound-Control Sealant I thought I was getting the OSI 175 you recommended... but this is what the guy had for me when I got there... and at that price I figured it was worth trying. Guess we'll see....

Here's the Miracle SCS-100 Sound-Control Sealant data sheet. Hey Stick -- next time you're heading out to AMS on a weekday, PM me first -- I work about two miles from there and it'd be cool to put a face to your name other than the infant's. ;-) --Keith :mrgreen:

yeah i got miracle too, from ams' location in san leandro. i hope it doesn't suck. the said they had USG in stock, and then when i got there they said they were out :cry: i'm pretty sure i paid more than that though.

Well, I'm about to cut the first tip... we'll soon see. Of course, I have no previous caulk experience... Hey, do you guy know where I can get the putty packs around here? Is that something Home Depot will have?

Pretty sure the putty packs are a "not at a Home Depot kind of place" thing. I just discovered they're actually called Putty Pads. Here's a place that sells them online. (Yes, I'm adding this to the Building Products area!) --Keith :mrgreen:

Sheesh, those aren't cheap, eh? Fortunately, I think I'm going to go the surface mount route for the studio interior. And for the one fixture box on the wall I'm doing now it's mounted flush to a 2x6, which is up against the first of my 3 layers. So, I figure if I caulk each layer around it, it ought to be a decent seal. And if not, I can always add putty from the front. For the other wall where I'll be reinforcing from the garage side, I'll probably spring for the putty pads. Only 3 to cover, so it won't break the bank. Thanks for the link. In other news, the Miracle caulk seems to be working fine... it comes out of the tube, and cleans nicely with water, so assuming it doesn't shrink I think we've found a winner. However, since I already ordered a 12 pack from the east coast, we'll have a comparison. Oh well. If that's the only materials mistake I make I'll be thrilled. HA!

Stick wrote:

Sheesh, those aren't cheap, eh?

I think you get what you pay for... I wonder how many electrical fire disasters could have been avoided if these things had been used... :roll:

Fortunately, I think I'm going to go the surface mount route for the studio interior.

I was seriously considering that myself... But I decided that would be a real pain, if not right away, then in the future if the room gets repurposed. I'm always annoyed when I can't push furniture against a wall because outlets (or, more accurately, the electric plugs connected to them) are in the way... :evil: I've even gone so far as cutting holes in the back of my nightstands to account for this -- I access the outlets by removing the drawers and reaching through to the back. Looking forward to further caulk reporting.

sharward wrote:

I was seriously considering that myself... But I decided that would be a real pain, if not right away, then in the future if the room gets repurposed. I'm always annoyed when I can't push furniture against a wall because outlets (or, more accurately, the electric plugs connected to them) are in the way... :evil: I've even gone so far as cutting holes in the back of my nightstands to account for this -- I access the outlets by removing the drawers and reaching through to the back.

Good point... I'll probably have a pretty good idea of where all the furniture and stuff will go. (I say that now... ha!) After going around one fixture with the first layer today, I'll be glad to save the time (and labor $$) for that hassle. I was thinking we could still run the wire inside the wall and just poke it through a little hole, which is easily filled (with putty?!) or whatever. Or would it be better to run conduit around the walls? That might get a little ugly unless I was going for that industrial look.

Well, my "mere mortal" understanding is that ideal isolation is achieved with the fewest number of penetrations as possible, so that would point to surface conduit. You can minimize the "industrial look" of it by using Wiremold products (but that stuff gets really expensive quickly). However, I'm really sold on the putty pads, not just for what they do for isolation, but also for their firestopping power. I'm under the impression (hopefully not a false one) that using the pads is pretty darned close to doing surface mount. At a cost of less than five bucks per box, I think it's worth it. Remember -- there's a price premium for the fire rating testing and certification (as well there should be). Compared with the cost of surface conduit of any type, I'm pretty sure that the putty pads are a great value. Note that I didn't actually shop for the putty pads -- I just linked up the most obvious source. If you decide to go for the putty pads and find a better deal, then please update the thread I started in the Business Products forum with your source. By the way, I'm assuming you're not doing this with a permit, 'cuz if you were, your framing inspection and your rough electrical inspection are usually done at the same time... :roll: --Keith :mrgreen:

Note that I didn't actually shop for the putty pads -- I just linked up the most obvious source. If you decide to go for the putty pads and find a better deal, then please update the thread I started in the Business Products forum with your source.

Yeah, I think the pads are a good plan. And for the amount of isolation I'm after, I think wire sized holes filled with putty will probably do fine. And definately faster to construct than drywalling around electrical boxes in the wall. Thanks for the help. So far so good with the caulk... hopefully it's all where I put it in the morning!

Well, as much as I hate to say it, the Titebond caulk is better than the Miracle stuff. Titebond doesn't shrink at all. Miracle did a little. And the Titebond is a little easier to squeeze out... it's softer. I'll be checking with AMS to see if they can get it here in town. Too bad, I was really liking the idea of the cheapness of the Miracle stuff. So, I've got one outerleaf wall of my studio done. Took down the stucco, and put up 2 5/8" and 1 1/2" layer. We did this wall first only because it's the fireplace wall in the living room that was the last wall to be completed for the house interior. Now, the rest of the garage has to be torn apart, and then we'll start over. But first, I must do some real work. Off to Poland for a week or so of sessions and mixes.

Great feedback about Titebond vs. Miracle, Stick. Thanks!! Have a good trip... We'll be here when you get back! ;-) --Keith :mrgreen:

Ok, so back in the saddle after a week of sessions in Warsaw, and a week of recovering from the fever/flu/cold I picked up just before I came home. Let me tell you, the 28 hours of travelling weren't too much fun going from chills to sweating, achey muscles (before sitting in Economy for 10 hours at a stretch), and a headache off and on. Anyway, back up to speed now. On to the studio: I've made the decision (partly thanks to your prodding, Keith) to hire a local architect to draw plans in order to deal with getting the proper permits and whatnot to be "legal". A couple guys that I've talked to seemed comfortable with what I'm doing, and didn't freak out when I told them I had pretty set ideas on wall constructions and whatnot. So, I think I should be on my way in the next month or so for that direction. In the mean time, I've posted my plan over on the design forum, so I'd love it if you guys would nit-pick it over there for the more design related elements that could have an effect on my final drawings. I.E. are my windows in good spots, are the walls splayed right, do I have enough bass trapping, do my doors open the right way, how do I get the cables to and from the gear, that sort of nonsense. Some of this I've thought about, some I haven't but really need to. Ok, in other news. The first multi-layer wall on the inside of the house is up and finished and looks great. It surrounds the fireplace, and is sealed up nice and tight. It was humorous to see my caulk job compared to the one day where I had to have my contractor do it... I'm such a hack. Oh well, I bet I'm pretty decent at it by the time we're done building! Ok, back to mixing... gotta get this record done and back to Warsaw.

Stick wrote:

. . . recovering from the fever/flu/cold I picked up

Oh man! :( Sorry to hear that. Hope you're feeling better.

I've made the decision (partly thanks to your prodding, Keith) to hire a local architect to draw plans in order to deal with getting the proper permits and whatnot to be "legal".

Right on! 8) 8) 8) That's awesome!

In the mean time, I've posted my plan over on the design forum, so I'd love it if you guys would nit-pick it over there for the more design related elements . . .

Yeah -- everyone, follow this link to Stick's thread on the Design forum. --Keith :mrgreen:

Yeah, I feel about 98% now... however now my wife and 18 mo old have some sort of stomach thing... good times here. Puke EVERYWHERE! Thanks Keith...

LOL! The only change would be the element of unpredictablility the 18 month old creates. He can't just sit in one place and puke in the same general direction each time. I only had to change my and his clothes twice this morning though. :roll:

Ok, Keith, I know we talked about this, but I can't remember where we landed on it, so I thought I'd run it out there and see what thoughts the gang might have. On the upper right of this pic, is my machine room. The wall between the control room and the machine room is not planned to be a "beefy" wall. The green topped walls in the drawing are the 3 drywall layer walls. Is this the best way? I know I've got 3 masses in that section, but I don't see how to avoid it and put in a closed machine/storage room. Should that machine room wall the be the beefy one and just have the machine room as part of the "space between the walls"? If I did that, is there a benefit to having the HVAC cooling that area... it would have to in order to keep the computers cool... hence the need for a machine room. I know I came up with a reason why I drew it this way, but I can't remember what it was... delirium is setting in.

I'm beginning to wonder whether it would make sense to make both walls beefy. You'd then have a third-leaf effect on the last (house) wall, so you may have to increase beefage on the other two. Just a thought. Not sure if it's right or not.

Hmmm, yeah. I guess I don't understand exactly what that "third leaf effect" is. What's the manifestation of the weakness? More low end getting through all the walls? I'm not sure I've got a low-end proof enough design to worry about it. The fact that I'm building on a slab that's shared with my living room in the house is probably a few points against in the low end transmission war. I'm not building a bunker. I'm after that happy medium where I'm happy because I don't hear much of the kids banging around in the house, and they're happy because they don't have to listen to the same song for a week or two at a time in 4 to 5 second clips, followed by the out of tune singer being fixed for a few hours a line at a time. Yeah, the music biz is SO glamorous. Granted with this plan, they may hear a little low thump thump when I've got the mix up loud, but I don't do that too much. And yeah, I'll probably hear them when both boys are jumping up and down on the raised and very noisy wood floor in the dining room, directly adjacent to the studio... Sheesh, must be late... I'm rambling.

Well, not everyone needs a bunker, so it's good that you recognize that you probably don't need one. However, there are two ways to avoid being disappointed -- overkill everything, or do all the homework needed to build close to exactly what you need and expect the outcome to be close to that. What's not good is having moderate expectations but not building to that spec and then being disappointed with the results. :roll: