control room design, build, acoustics

I assume when you say for the inside of the room you mean for the back wall, bass traps, panels and stuff like that right?

Exactly. Greg

Today some of the framing was completed. :D

Even though I did that last drawing for you, I don't fully understand your build. But, I trust that you know what you're doing. It's just like building some Ikea furniture in that you have a detailed plan to follow :wink: Greg

No problem, actually we didnt need a plan for the outer frame but things are going good. As i said i am not going for a professional room. Just wanted to share some progress :) Next step -> outer ceiling frames

hey Greg how are you ? i have a question about the materials i should be using on my wings i have seen people building them like resonators, others (under the speakers height) with cloth and insulation inside, and others just wall. What would you suggest? The room is still being constructed, i am just working on it all day but i will post some photos soon. Thanks in advance.

Hey :D posting some pics ... so excited ! :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

i have seen people building them like resonators, others (under the speakers height) with cloth and insulation inside, and others just wall. What would you suggest?

Sorry it took so long to reply. I've been super busy with nice weather doing landscaping at our place while I have time. Personally I like leaving the bottom area of the baffles open for absorption. Personally, I feel that resonator designs often cause reflection issues and also mess with the whole infinite baffle concept. You haven't posted a SketchUp file or detailed pictures showing your design so I can't comment on your work so far. But, if you're excited, that's great news! Greg

Greg, thanks for the reply i already build them hard surface. I will post the sketchup files soon although I think I have taken care of all the reflections. Just a quick question about the front wall between the speaker baffles. Option 1 Wood surface only Option 2 Wood surface while leaving the bottom open for absorption. Option3 Rock surface Option 4 Rock surface while leaving the bottom open for absorption. Option5 Absorption only Thanks again!!

Hi, It looks like you're going for a total infinite baffle concept, so your whole front wall and wings are reflective with no bass trapping. You don't really have any space in the middle for adequate bass trapping, so you could make it reflective to low frequencies but absorptive to mids and highs by putting 4" or so of treatment on the surface. It would be difficult for you to add any significant bass trapping to your front wall now without taking the panels off and putting hangers or whatever behind it and leaving some open ports for the LF to enter. But, if you have adequate bass trapping on your rear wall, ceiling and corners then you may find that is good enough. The good news is, (providing it is completely sealed air tight), having a completely continuous and sealed baffle you will 1. eliminate SBIR from the front wall 2. eliminate edge diffraction and 3. expect an increase in low end headroom since the drivers will be firing into half space. If you have a desk with a meter bridge then the floor bounce can be dealt with by positioning the desk in the right place so that the floor reflection is blocked by it. You could even put some trapping/treatment on the rear of the console to help deal with that too. A stone facade on the front wall is often used by Newell and according to him because the speakers do not "see" the front wall the uneven, slightly diffusive surface is not an issue, but it helps the listener psycho-acoustically since it provides a familiar surface for self noise cues to reflect off of. Paul

Hey Paul and thanks for your time ! :)

You don't really have any space in the middle for adequate bass trapping, so you could make it reflective to low frequencies but absorptive to mids and highs by putting 4" or so of treatment on the surface.

That's what i was thinking. Or i could add more depth in the space between the speaker baffles. I could add a layer of rockwool on the wood surface then framing it, then leaving a small air-gap, then some fiberglass OR rockwool (still cant understand what difference it makes). Does it sound like a good idea? if yes, should i do it on the whole surface or just under the speakers height?

But, if you have adequate bass trapping on your rear wall, ceiling and corners then you may find that is good enough

I have left the whole rear wall untreated and unfinished but i intend to make it full absorptive. Its just that i still haven't found a legit way to do it. Only problem is that when i was still designing the room i didnt knew that i would need hangers in the rear wall so now i need to do it another way. Maybe you have some options for me :) About the ceiling i was going to leave it untreated, do you think that absorption on the ceiling is necessary? Maybe later i can add some panels if needed. kon

Some updates . . .

any thoughts ? :roll:

Hi, You don’t necessarily have to use hangers on the rear wall, it’s just one method. You can use just thick fiber or membrane traps for example. You definitely need to treat the ceiling, in fact in my opinion it needs the most treatment due to it being the shortest dimension. Ideally you would have thick bass and broadband trapping up there, but ofcourse you will only be able to do so much as you also need to be able to stand up in the room too. Leave the floor completely reflective. You could bring the middle section of your speaker wall out a little if you wanted to get some broadband treatment between the speakers, sure. Paul

hi, Thank you for all those info! :D Any good designs or thread about broadband traps (are those what I've seen named clouds?) for the ceiling? And/or for the rear wall ? My English are not so good, hope i make sense :P

Hallo everyone posting some updates from last year before i continue to finish my studio :D I missed this forum as much as i missed building my project. I will post a to do list with things that still need to be done as soon as i am ready to start again. Any thoughts or ideas are always welcome :D

nice workpersonship!

Thank you glenn !! :D

gullfo wrote:

nice workpersonship!

Glenn i sent you a pm but i cant find it in my sent messages folder, can you please check ? Thank you!

(treatment starts here) So, i though i might get away with rew but today i did my first measurements and i have to say it was not that hard. Or maybe i did it all wrong :P After i followed the calibration instructions for the soundcard , levels and the spl meter, i did 1 sweep with the microphone placed in the listening position facing the left speaker, and one for the other speaker. Is this what i was supposed to do? Here are some screenshots and the files with 1/12 smoothing applied for left, right speaker, and average.

so next step - hanging a bunch of absorbers on the walls and ceiling. 600mm x 1600mm x 100mm on the walls, first reflection points, and 600mm x 1600mm x 200mm absorbers on the ceiling. after first reflection points, spacing them about 400mm-600mm apart.

gullfo wrote:

so next step - hanging a bunch of absorbers on the walls and ceiling. 600mm x 1600mm x 100mm on the walls, first reflection points, and 600mm x 1600mm x 200mm absorbers on the ceiling. after first reflection points, spacing them about 400mm-600mm apart.

Nice, thank you for answering. :D About first reflection points, the whole front area of the room is designed so no reflections lead back to my listening position (except the floor), the angles of the walls and ceiling (wooden areas that you can see in the pictures) are designed to lead the reflections to the back of the room. Can i avoid hanging absorbers there? If yes then following your above instructions, i will hang three panels to the left wall 2 to the right wall (because there is a window :( ) and 6 to the ceiling. The whole rear wall will be absorptive. Would it make a huge difference buying them from Gik than building them my own?

there is always reflections :) it's a matter of finding which ones are problematic. even though your design is meant to avoid reflections at the listening position, in reality, there will be some because most speaker HF drivers will have greater than 60° horizontal dispersion and likely 20° or more vertical dispersion. and the cross-firing of the speakers mean there will be reflections. so adding absorption - prefer open sides - just past your side baffles can help. same on the cloud. also, in front of your console or desk (or on the lower position of the front wall) as that will reflect back to the hard front wall and then scatter which can be problematic as well.

gullfo wrote:

just past your side baffles can help

do you mean option 1, 2 or 3?

position #1 those flat surfaces. you're likely going to need a bunch down the length of those walls to kill off slap echoes as well.

gullfo wrote:

down the length

Do you mean the same height with the side walls? Or the same length?