Seattle Area Home Studio

Wow I cant believe I'm actually posting! I've been hanging around the site for about 2 years and I have finally managed to make some time to develop my space! Location/Room Details: I am located in the Seattle Washington area My room dimensions are 26'L X 14' 1"W X 8'H Sketch up shows windows doors and service panel locations Overview: Right now I use my room for all kinds of music production in its current 1 room config. It's really rough but I manage:) Ultimately I need to create... a control room that provides good enough isolation to talk, and not be to concerned about the squeaks in my chair while tracking!!! I really want to be confident in the acoustic nature of the room while I'm mixing, and I really want the control room to be a comfortable environment. I know my space is limited but since I spend the most time in the CR it's my priority. As Im putting this all down I'm reflecting on some of the rooms I have worked in (including the current) and laughing at myself. It can only get better!!!! Studio Primarily it needs to accommodate tracking vocals, acoustic instruments, electric guitars, and drums. Doable? Should I try to work in a vocal booth? and Storage...need some bad!:) I'm in the planning stage. Really anxious to get back to making music! I'm loud! But I live far enough from my neighbors that it is not a concern. Construction is 2x4 framing 16"OC with single layer 1/2" gypsum on walls and lid. Floor is concrete, and the ceiling is flat. There are 2 exterior doors and 2 windows as shown in the skp. All sizes and locations are accurate. There is an electrical sub panel located in one corner, also shown in the drawing:) Both the windows face a breezeway that seperates the first floor of the house from the studio, they are non essential and can be covered up. I will try to get some pics posted. I DO NOT want to float the floor:) I have a Max budget of $10,000. I am a general contractor and will perform all the work myself. Questions: -I based my drawing on a small studio drawing that john did for somebody and posted. My room is a little bigger but the design seemed reasonable and scalable so I used it. Now that I've drawn it I'm wondering if there is another more fitting approach to the room. I would love to hear some feedback. -I added a closet to the studio because I need storage. I haven't come across any posts on best methods for creating storage in the studio. If I'm just missing it could you point me in the right direction? How will the closet affect the rooms behavior? I cant imagine it wont create issues. What is a better way to gain storage? -I didn't use a double wall system for the studio portion because I am only concerned with shaping the sound in that room for the purpose of recording, not necessarily keeping it inside the building...does it matter? Would I get better results if I went the extra mile with it? -I feel like I will be able to get good results with most of what I do (Drums, Acoustic instruments, Amps, Vocals) That said...should I concern myself with a vocal booth? -In Johns drawing of the control room he gabled the ceiling at 12 degrees. I think that since I have widened the CR a bit, it wont work for me to maintain that pitch and stay decoupled...or get through the door!!!:) Can I do clouds? I've observed a few flat ceilings in other posts. How should I configure the ceiling in the CR? -Somebody did a great job of explaining M-A-M in another part of the forum (I can't remember who it was but...Thanks!) In his example He makes a strong case for keeping the layers on the outside's of the framing in order to maximize the amount of "air" in between leafs. He used the spring analogy...the more air the looser the spring. In Johns drawing (and some other posts) suggests placing the layers to the inside of the framing in order to utilize the framing cavities for conditioning the sound inside the rooms. This saves resources and space Both make total sense to me...how do you balance their value? Also for the life of me I cant figure how to do a good job with the layers on the inside without creating an air gap large enough to word in. Thoughts? Maybe I answered my own question:) -Doors and windows...again...somebody posted a drawing for creating affordable interior doors that helped me land how I will do mine...if your reading this...Thanks! I'm concerned about the sliding doors that separate the CR from the studio resonating. John talks about it in the manual but I need a little hand holding. Inside a 3 1/2" wall is it possible to offset the angles of the doors enough to really be effective? Anybody got any good drawings? -Doors and windows...AGAIN! I know I can build really effective doors to use instead of the sliders but it would be a sight line issue. The only reason I'm thinking about it is for budgeting. It seems like windows and hinged doors might be more affordable...I havent priced glass in a while so I'm not sure. Any other Ideas of affordable options here? You will note exterior doors in both rooms. Technically I could 86 the doors all together and just utilize the exterior breezeway but it means going outside...might not suck? Could totally suck!!! Thoughts? Suggstions? Ok that's it for now. Totally love this forum and refer people to it all the time. Thanks!http://www.johnlsayers.com/phpBB2/posting.php?mode=post&f=1#

Hi there "dorfnork". Welcome. Please read the forum rules for posting (click here). You seem to be missing a couple of things! :)

Somebody did a great job of explaining M-A-M in another part of the forum (I can't remember who it was but...Thanks!) In his example He makes a strong case for keeping the layers on the outside's of the framing in order to maximize the amount of "air" in between leafs. He used the spring analogy...the more air the looser the spring. In Johns drawing (and some other posts) suggests placing the layers to the inside of the framing in order to utilize the framing cavities for conditioning the sound inside the rooms. This saves resources and space Both make total sense to me...how do you balance their value?

The two factors that determine the amount of isolation in all cases, are the amount of mass on the two leaves, and the depth of the cavity between them. Note that it is the depth of the CAVITY that matters: the distance from the surface of the mass on one side to the surface of the mass on the other side, regardless of where the studs are, or if there is insulation in there. You will always need treatment inside the room; that goes without saying. What John's "inside out" design accomplishes is to put the stud bays in the room, where you can put them to good use for treatment. If you go with conventional construction, then the studs are inside the wall cavity, and you just have blank drywall staring at you, so you then need to hang your treatment on that, and go hunting for studs so you can do that. You are also forced to use surface-mount electrical ducts, which increases cots. With John's design, the studs are right there, and you can use the bays between them to run your electrical, as well as filling them with insulation for basic treatment, then adding things like slots, membrane traps, bass traps, or whatever it is you need. The final front face of the acoustic treatment will be in roughly the same location in both cases, but in John's design you can have much more treatment at lower cost, since you don't need to add any additional framing to do it.

Also for the life of me I cant figure how to do a good job with the layers on the inside without creating an air gap large enough to word in.

One word: Fabric. With John's design, the final surface for much of the room is fabric, not drywall. Or wood slats over fabric (slot walls). Or other devices over the studs.

I'm concerned about the sliding doors that separate the CR from the studio resonating. John talks about it in the manual but I need a little hand holding. Inside a 3 1/2" wall is it possible to offset the angles of the doors enough to really be effective?

Well, you don't just have ONE set of 3-1/2" studs: you have TWO sets, and you have one sliding glass door (acoustic rated) in each frame: So there's one slider in your inner-leaf, and another one in your outer leaf. So no offset or angling is needed: The two sides of the wall (two leaves) can be parallel, in which case the doors are also parallel. Or you can angle them walls (and doors) if you want, but there is no acoustic need for that.

It seems like windows and hinged doors might be more affordable...

Right. Acoustic-rated sliding glass doors are very pricey. That thickness of laminated glass in panes that big, does not come cheap!

I havent priced glass in a while so I'm not sure.

Call a local glass company, and ask for their basic price per square foot for 3/8", 1/2" and 5/8" laminated glass... But sit down and take a deep breath before you ask...

Construction is 2x4 framing 16"OC with single layer 1/2" gypsum

1/2" is too thin: too light weight, too flexible, etc. Use only 5/8" fire-rated drywall. One last comment: I noticed your CR is isolated, but your LR is not. Reason? OK, another comment: You seem to have misunderstood the right rear panel of the CR in John's design: That thing running diagonally across the right rear corner is not a wall: it is a bass trap! That's just a simple wooden frame with fabric on it, no drywall. So you can't put a door in it, and it is not part of your inner leaf. - Stuart -