Hey folks! So I've been recording for a good 8 or so years now and I just love it. I'm a qualified Mechanical Engineer (between jobs at the moment) so my music is just a hobby, at least for now. I have a property and a house. The house needs renovation! This is my first priority so my actual studio build is likely to be a good 5 years off (after I finish the house reno), but for now I'm just getting excited and thinking of possibilities.
So, what do we have? I have a section of uneven land (about 1m rise over the floor space). It's close to a HUGE tree so there will be lots of big roots in the ground. The only option is really putting this studio on stumps. The difficulty is getting some good holes into the ground around the roots, but that's another issue for another time. How much space do I have available? Quite a bit for a hobby studio, but my dream is to one day look into commercial possibilities. We are looking at about 10m (33') wide, 20m (67') long and there is a tree branch at about 4m (13') up, after level ground from the stumps. If a sloping roof is used, that 4m heigh can easily be pushed to 5m (17') and maybe even beyond. I'm quite lucky with my space.
Now I don't necessarily plan to use ALL the space. Infact, I'd probably tend to not due to the cost involved. Speaking of cost, what's my budget? So far, I can't really say. I'm at such an early stage that I couldn't give a number. It all depends on how I'm going with work, how much my house costs, and how much the wife lets me spend :roll:
What would I use this for? I expect I'd get a lot of early bands for demo work but I'd like to be able to do some really high quality stuff too. I'm involved with A Cappella groups so a big space could be handy. I'd like to be able to do plenty of drums, vocals and guitars. Obviously a full on chorus ensemble is out of the question, but I'd like to be able to fit maybe up to 10 people in at once if I can afford the size.
I like the idea of a one room studio for a few reasons. One is space. Large rooms are great. They sound great (with appropriate treatment) and the bass response is smoothest (if designed well). I prefer the idea of having one great big sounding room than a small control room and small live room. The other is for a big more of an intimate feel for the artist. We have all heard of the artists that felt more relaxed singing in the control room with the engineer. Some people don't like to be boxed up in a little vocal booth or feel alone in this room. They like to hear the engineer in person. I expect I'd tend to get more beginners than seasoned pros in my studio so I imagine more would tend to like this design rather than a typical studio set up. I think it adds something different to what's out there. There are downsides. I can't monitor with monitors and must use headphones, I must be dead silent, any other people in the room must be tamed as well. But I can deal with that. It also gives me the easy option of the old inverted polarity monitor trick for vocalists who don't like using headphones. I want a studio that people can feel comfortable in so I can get the best possible performance out of them.
I also want to look at the idea of an adjustable room. I want to look at options to quickly convert it from a live wood sound, to a dead vocal sound. Maybe some simple panels which I can turn around to make reflective or absorptive could be an interesting option? Or would it be more complicated than that to really get great results?
I'll need a fair bit of isolation. I'm very close to a main road which has a lot of idiots who like to drive their super charged cars around as loud as they can. I'm also about 50m away from a pub which has bands every now and then. Fortunately, I have the space and the freedom of a brand new build to make floating walls and super thick (even 1m thick if necessary) insulation all around. I can build with non parallel walls and a sloped ceiling straight off the bat. I have a lot of options which is really exciting.
So what do I want from you? Well, I'd love to hear your comments on this plan. Does my idea for a one room studio make sense? Would including a vocal booth or a few isolation rooms be a good idea? Maybe a drum room should be fit in? Or even maybe a standard separate control room if it makes ultimately more sense? I'm so early now in my design that I'm just brainstorming. Open to any ideas.
Something BIG to keep in mind is I would like to be able to mix and edit video in here as well. I would love to get into short films in the future so the option to expand to 5.1 is something I'd like to keep open in my design. Room for a big TV would also be ideal if I go down that path.
One final question that is nagging me, but not so important just yet, is the desk position. If I use the one room design, should I face my desk INTO the room so I can see the artist performing, or would it make more acoustic sense to face into the end of the room, so my back is to the centre of the room and artist. The second configuration would make it easier to place a big TV for film, but it might feel less personal to a client as I've got to turn around. Maybe even a double desk type idea would be cool. I could face my main mixing desk into the end wall, but behind me have all my gear racks and a simple computer monitor and second mouse and keyboard so I can use that just when recording. Positives and negatives for both. I'd probably ultimately lean towards the best mixing environment as my priority here, which makes me think facing into the wall.
Anyway, a nice big first post for me! I hope I did well and I'd love to hear your comments on these ideas. If money is looking good, there is a good chance I'd look into some consult time with John at various stages of the design and build. I'm only 2.5hrs away being at the Gold Coast so that makes it easy! Speaking of which, John, I'm sure you know the area well, does a one room studio like this sound like something that might be lacking in the market up here? I'd like something that is a little different and not just ANOTHER studio...
Cheers guys :D
One Room Studio From Scratch - Research Stage
Originally posted at johnlsayers.com, topic 18313.
Hi there "MattLyonsMusic", and welcome to the forum! :)
That's a very, very smart move. It can take a while to learn about studio design, acoustics, isolation, treatment, techniques, materials, HVAC and all the other things that you need to know (realistically, several months), then several months more to actually design the studio. So getting a really early start on it like you are doing, is excellent.my actual studio build is likely to be a good 5 years off (after I finish the house reno), but for now I'm just getting excited and thinking of possibilities.
Hmmmmm..... you might want to get some expert advice about that. Trees seem to like growing, and the always seem to do it in the way you least expect, and that will cause you the most harm. So I'd get in someone who knows about trees and foundations, to tell you how to approach this.So, what do we have? I have a section of uneven land (about 1m rise over the floor space). It's close to a HUGE tree so there will be lots of big roots in the ground. The only option is really putting this studio on stumps. The difficulty is getting some good holes into the ground around the roots,
You sure are! That's a REALLY nice area you have there, and plenty good enough for a great studio. Especially with that height.about 10m (33') wide, 20m (67') long and there is a tree branch at about 4m (13') up, after level ground from the stumps. If a sloping roof is used, that 4m heigh can easily be pushed to 5m (17') and maybe even beyond. I'm quite lucky with my space.
Are you thinking of several iso booths, or just one large live room? I would suggest at least one vocal booth, and also a drum booth, as those are the two things that will likely give you the most hassle, but from opposite ends.I'd like to be able to do some really high quality stuff too. I'm involved with A Cappella groups so a big space could be handy. I'd like to be able to do plenty of drums, vocals and guitars.
I'm not so sure that it is out of the question: With potentially 200 m2, that's a lot of space. You can get an awful lot of people in there...Obviously a full on chorus ensemble is out of the question,
OK, I guess that answers my previous question... ! :)I like the idea of a one room studio for a few reasons.
With the amount of space you have there, NOTHING has to be small. You can conceivably have a control room large enough to meet ITU, EBU, and AES specs for critical listening, plus a live room large enough to meet the reverb criteria for studios, plus a very decent size drum booth, plus a vocal booth, and still only use about half of your total available area. You do no need to skimp on space. And for me at least, I find it impossible to accurately mic drums that are on the same room as the monitors, since I cannot hear what each mic is hearing, coming from the monitors, as the direct sound from the drum kit overpowers the subtle details that I'm listening for. So at the very least I would stick with my original suggestion of a control room, a live room, a drum booth, and a vocal booth. All of them big.I prefer the idea of having one great big sounding room than a small control room and small live room.
Right. So put those people in the control room, but in order to do that you have to actually HAVE a control room!!! :) And put others who prefer the isolation, in the vocal booths. Or, as the case may be, put the guitar cab in the vocal booth, mic it, and have the player in the control room with you, listening clearly on the monitors, instead of "dirtily" with the cab in the room. If you want to do commercial work in your studio, at the very least you'll need a separate control room. You won't get many seasoned musicians / producers returning to your place if there's no separate control room... If you like the concept of intimacy, then just use lots of glass between the rooms, for great sight-lines and visibility.The other is for a big more of an intimate feel for the artist. We have all heard of the artists that felt more relaxed singing in the control room with the engineer. Some people don't like to be boxed up in a little vocal booth or feel alone in this room.
You might be surprised... I've had more than just a few beginners who prefer the privacy of a vocal booth, rather than the public exposure of a single large room... There's more than one type of musician out there: some love privacy, others love the control room, others love just jamming all together in a nice large live room.I expect I'd tend to get more beginners than seasoned pros in my studio so I imagine more would tend to like this design rather than a typical studio set up.
Yup! :shock: :!:There are downsides.
:ahh: So why build a studio then? :)I can't monitor with monitors and must use headphones
And so must all your equipment.... So you'll need a fanless DAW with all solid-state hard disks, extremely quiet HVAC system (NC 15 or lower), a silent keyboard, a silent mouse, a silent console (no flying faders), a silent chair on silent wheels, and plenty of cough drops.... :) Sorry if I sound a little skeptical, but it just don't see your plan working. The reason people here on the forum occasionally opt for single room studios is because they have severe space limitations, and dividing up their tiny little area into two rooms would make both of them unusable. You do not have that problem. You have more than enough space to do it right.I must be dead silent, any other people in the room must be tamed as well.
Fine! Then make the control room big enough that you can do that for the artists who really like it, but also make the studio usable for other artists too, who prefer a more traditional recording environment. You have the space to get the best of both worlds. It would be a shame to wast that...I want a studio that people can feel comfortable in so I can get the best possible performance out of them.
That's the basic idea, yes: panels that slide, fold, or swivel to reveal either a highly reflective side, or a highly absorbent side, or perhaps a diffusive side. There's many ways of doing that. However, that is more suitable for a small to medium size live room: in a really large room, you'd need a very large number of panels to change, in order to make an appreciable difference to the acoustics. And you certainly do not want to have variable acoustics in the control room: that's a contradiction in terms. In order to be usable for mixing, the control room must have absolutely neutral response, in both the time and frequency domains, across the board. It must also be perfectly symmetrical, and have the correct geometry, shape and treatment. You can't change that if you hope to produce mixes that translate well.I also want to look at the idea of an adjustable room. I want to look at options to quickly convert it from a live wood sound, to a dead vocal sound. Maybe some simple panels which I can turn around to make reflective or absorptive could be an interesting option? Or would it be more complicated than that to really get great results?
That's excellent, but you'll also need a pretty hefty budget to float your walls and/or floor(s) properly. Doing it right is not as easy as the idiot YouTube videos would lead you to believe... Not even in the same ballpark.Fortunately, I have the space and the freedom of a brand new build to make floating walls
Insulation does not isolate. It can be part of an isolation system, sure, but on its own it isn't much use for isolating rooms.and super thick (even 1m thick if necessary) insulation all around.
There are only a very few basic reasons for building non-parallel walls: flutter echo (which can be dealt with in other ways), RFZ or CID design concept for the control room, or just because it looks cool. That's about it. Which of those were you thinking of? You need different angles and approaches for each of those, so it's important to identify why you want your walls non-parallel.I can build with non parallel walls and a sloped ceiling straight off the bat.
:) I think I already covered that one... 8) :shot:I'd love to hear your comments on this plan. Does my idea for a one room studio make sense?
Absolutely and definitely YES!Would including a vocal booth or a few isolation rooms be a good idea?
Absolutely and definitely YES!Maybe a drum room should be fit in?
Absolutely and definitely YES!Or even maybe a standard separate control room if it makes ultimately more sense?
In what way? I mean, are you talking about doing Foley work for movies, or ADR, or sound tracks, or more like post-production off-line, or on-line, or maybe jingles for TV commercials, or music videos? Lots of different options, lots of differences in the way you might want to set up your place. My background is in designing on-line post-production suites, so I'm hoping you'll say that's what you want to do.... :)Something BIG to keep in mind is I would like to be able to mix and edit video in here as well.
If you want 5.1 in the future, then the control room has to be designed for it right now, even if you only use it as 2.0 or 2.1 initially. 2.0 sounds great in a room designed for 5.1 room, but 5.1 sounds terrible in a room designed only for 2.0 / 2.1. So if that's your plane, then definitely, certainly, absolutely design it fully for 5.1 to start with.so the option to expand to 5.1 is something I'd like to keep open in my design.
With a one-room design, you'd almost certainly have to work with your back to the room, due to the requirements of the control room setup itself. So you'd not be able to have direct eye contact with the artists easily. On the other hand, in a multi-room set up, you can have windows on the front and side walls, and have a great view of the artists all around you. Live room in front, vocal booth on one side, drum booth on the other.... :)If I use the one room design, should I face my desk INTO the room so I can see the artist performing, or would it make more acoustic sense to face into the end of the room, so my back is to the centre of the room and artist.
Exactly.but it might feel less personal to a client as I've got to turn around.
And a second console, slaved to the main one, so you can adjust as necessary on the fly, without having to make any noise spinning around in your chair all the time. Not to mention the issue of the stereo image being backwards behind you, and your pan controls reveresed to your ears... Nor the rather strange way it would sound to be facing the rear wall in a 5.1 set-up :shock: :!: :cry:Maybe even a double desk type idea would be cool. I could face my main mixing desk into the end wall, but behind me have all my gear racks and a simple computer monitor and second mouse and keyboard so I can use that just when recording.
I'm not sure that I see any positives from working back.to.front, and duplicating your system....Positives and negatives for both.
Yup! Where you can't see the artists.... unless you have a separate control room with glass that allows you to see them... :) Anyway, you have a great space here, with excellent options, and I'd really encourage you to re-think the "single room" concept. It just makes no sense when you have so much space available to you, and can build a control room that would allow for that anyway, while also allowing for all the other options with several rooms. - Stuart -I'd probably ultimately lean towards the best mixing environment as my priority here, which makes me think facing into the wall.