Simple control room layout in rehearsal space

Hello, This is my first post in this fantastic forum, so please excuse me if I do something wrong (also excuse my poor English). I find this place a great resource for someone like me who is trying to figure out how acoustics work. Not an easy task! So, I'm planning on setting up a small “control room” in a space that's left in a rehearsal room. The idea is building a small studio in the future, but for now I will install my gear and start making some recordings. I know it's not the best situation, since the rehearsal room and the control room are only divided by some thick curtains, but... About the place, the height is 9' 1'' (2,76 m). The floor is polished concrete, and the ceiling has acoustic panels, something like this: As far as problems with noise and neighbors, there's been nothing known to date. The problem is that I have to share the control room with another person with his own set of desk, speakers and gear. In the pictures you can see that I've positioned the two desks in something like a T fashion. Mine is the green wooden one. I've taken into account the symmetry of the room and the 38% rule as a starting point to place my listening position. Also, I know that the monitors should be placed like a triangle, but I'm learning Sketchup and don't know how to rotate them in a correct angle. These are two layouts so you can see better what I'm talking about. We've been trying different layouts, and these ones are the ones that my mate likes. So my question would be, are they good layouts acoustically speaking? Which one would be better? I would be very grateful if you could help me with this. Thank you!

Hola Neiler, y muy bienvenido al foro! También tenemos una sección en español, si prefieres usarla. Pero no hay ningún problema con tu inglés, tampoco! Está muy bien. :)

I know it's not the best situation, since the rehearsal room and the control room are only divided by some thick curtains, but...

That won't help very much at all, I'm afraid. Curtains are very poor at isolating, although they can help with the acoustics of the room.

About the place, the height is 9' 1'' (2,76 m). The floor is polished concrete,

That's good! You have a decent amount of height, and a very good floor, too.

and the ceiling has acoustic panels, something like this

That's not so good. Those types of panel are meant for typical office environments, not for studios. They'll help a bit, but not very much.

The problem is that I have to share the control room with another person with his own set of desk, speakers and gear.

Ouch! That's not good at all. Is there any way at all you could do something to divide the space, even a little bit? Maybe build some gobos on wheels, or something like that? That would not isolate the two areas, of course, but it would help a little bit, at least.

So my question would be, are they good layouts acoustically speaking? Which one would be better?

Neither of them is very good, as neither is symmetrical. In both cases the distance from your head to the left wall and to the right wall is very, very different, so you will not be able to get a good stereo image. Regarding which layout is better: They are probably about the same. I don't see any advantage with either of those two. I would really, really suggest you build some type of partition or movable gobo to divide the areas better. Of course, the best idea would be to build proper isolation walls, but that doesn't seem to be an option for you right now, so your next best thing is a fixed partition, and third best would be movable gobos. The gobos could be re-used later in the live room, if you ever do get to build a proper control room, so the money would not be wasted. - Stuart -

...there will be a good result on it

Please explain why you think there will be a good result, citing the acoustical reasons for your comment. Thanks - Stuart -

I think Jay is an artificial lifeform - certainly has artificial intelligence judging by the sum content of his posts :!:

certainly has artificial intelligence judging by the sum content of his post

:) ! I'll agree with the "artificial" part, but it's the other part I'm not too sure about! There isn't much sign of that ... :)

Thanks for your response and explanation, Stuart! And sorry for my late response. Mis próximos hilos los abriré en el foro de español :wink: About sharing the room, I forgot to tell that my mate and I will not use the room at the same time. I mean, there will be only one of us using the room each time, so I think there would be no need to use gobos in order to divide the space. Correct me if I'm wrong, please. Or maybe the gobos should be used for acoustic purposes? Won't they eat much space? About symmetry... Will it help if I put some broadband acoustic panels on the right wall? Something like this: Knowing that the situation is not perfect, what would be the best acoustic solution to improve the acoustics of the room? Muchas gracias!

About sharing the room, I forgot to tell that my mate and I will not use the room at the same time. I mean, there will be only one of us using the room each time

Ahhh! OK, that makes a difference. So you don't need to isolate the two "control rooms".

About symmetry... Will it help if I put some broadband acoustic panels on the right wall? Something like this:

You'll need those anyway, without any doubt, but the don't change the room symmetry problem. The issue is that the curtain on your left side does nothing to create symmetry. It is basically transparent to sound, except at very high frequencies, so on your left your ears are about 23 feet from the "real" left wall, and only about 7 feet from the right wall, so your stereo image will be greatly unbalanced. The frequency response and timing that you hear will be very different on each ear. That kind of gets us back to gobos again: You could build a few large, solid gobos to put just in front of the curtain, covering maybe two thirds of the span of the curtain, and as high as you can make them. That would help a lot to create some symmetry around you. Once again, it would be better to build an actual solid partition there, but if you are on a limited budget or if you are not allowed to do that type of change, then gobos are a good second choice. It won't be perfect, of course, but it would help a lot. Set up the gobos with the hard, solid, reflective side facing the live room, and the absorbent side facing your area. With the gobos in place, it would make sense to treat the rest of the room as if it were a normal control room: superchunks in all of the corners, thick absorption on first reflection points (the gobos on the left, plus the broadband absorbers you suggested on the right), a cloud over your desk, thick absorption on the rear wall, spaced away from it, and maybe a few more absorptive panels around the room, as needed. - Stuart -

Thanks again Stuart. I'll definitely build some gobos for the left wall. One more question if you don't mind. About the distance from the front of the monitors to the wall behind them, do you think it's good to place the monitors within a 1 meter span from the wall? In the link below they say it's better to place them near the wall. http://www.genelec.com/faq/acoustical/not-enough-bass/ I would like to know your opinion about it.

One more question if you don't mind. About the distance from the front of the monitors to the wall behind them, do you think it's good to place the monitors within a 1 meter span from the wall? In the link below they say it's better to place them near the wall.

I absolutely agree with Genelec. In fact, I'd go a bit further then they do, and say "less than 50 cm, more than 2.5 m". So if you can't get your speakers at least 2.5 m from the front wall, then get them as close as you can, within half a meter or even less if possible, and never more than 1 meter. Of course, the best idea is to mount them in soffits ("flush mount"), but second best is to get them up close to the front wall. However, this is where you have to start "juggling" and trading off for most rooms. The rules are: Speakers up tight against front wall. Speakers toed-in (angled) at 30 degrees, aiming at your ears. Ears at roughly 38% of room depth, on the center line of the room. Distance between the speakers must be roughly the same as the distance from ear to speaker. Speakers not close to side walls: space them about 25% of the room width away from the side walls. And of course, as you try to do that, you'll find that things don't fit! Unless you are very lucky, it will not be possible to obey all those "rules", so you have to nudge and tweak, sliding things around a bit, until you get the best compromise. So what do you compromise? First, "38%" is not a rule: just a guideline. Play around with that a bit first, moving your head a bit forwards or backwards, to see if you can hit the other conditions. But also don't go more than about 45% absolute maximum, nor less than about 30% absolute minmum, or you start getting into areas of the room with more serious modal issues. Second, adjust the angle a bit. If 30° doesn't work, try a bit more. But not more than 45°, maximum. Third, adjust the speaker-to-speaker distance a bit, either closer together or further apart. But one thing I would not adjust, is the distance of the speakers from the front walls: keep them up close, less than 50 cm, or if not then more than 2.5 m away. That's my approach, at least. Others might have different priorities, but that's my suggestion. As long as you understand what you are compromising with each adjustment, then you can decide what is the highest priority for you. For example, if you are in a really large room that is also well treated, then modal issues is most likely not a problem, so you can adjust the "38%" position a lot, without risking too much. But if you are in a small room with only basic treatment, then you can't move that much. Even a few inches will but you at 50% or 25%, which are the worst points. Another example: increasing the speaker angle broadens the sound stage and stereo image, but also squashes the sweet spot. So if you have a very large console, and need to move side-to-side a lot while you mix, then it would not be good to increase the angle too much: at 45°, you'll be out of the sweet spot very quickly as you move your head just a bit, and even turning your head will skew the stereo image, as one ear moves into the "shadow" of your head with respect to one speaker, and the other moves out of the shadow from the other speaker. Etc. So there are compromises and trade-offs in everything you do: you have to look at your room carefully, decide what your priorities are, and then decide which "rules" you can bend in order to get the least bad situation. - Stuart -