Help for home studio in sardinia

Hello, I'm Filippo, I write from Sardinia. I really hope you can land me a hand with my studio. As you'll see in the attached file, it's a little home studio made up of just 2 rooms where I make multitrack recordings. I'd like to improve the sound in there without changing the walls. Do you have any suggests?

Hey is anybody out there who can give me some good advice?

Boss, you gotta read this page at this link : viewtopic.php?f=17&t=7572 ...and then you have to submit as much information as you possible can in respect to this build. As it is, you have a sketch up drawing, which is a start, but it really means nothing as to what one could expect from the room and what you expect from the room, how much you are willing to be involved in this build...a lot of information still yet to be included just so we know, what you know.

Hi xSpace, thanks a lot for your reply. I apologize for haven't being precise enough. I did read the rules post but I think there's something I misunderstood - fault of my bad English. Anyway, here are the further details you might need about my studio. All walls and the ceiling are made of concrete painted and the floor is made of laminate wood. In the common wall between control and live room there’s a double window with laminated glass. Both rooms are treated with acoustic sound absorption foam (including bass traps) but there still are some annoying standing waves around and under 100Hz which compromise the acoustic ambience. The control room is currently placed in the room with parallel walls but I’m willing to set it in the other one if you think I can take advantage of that. I mainly use the studio for one instrument at a time recordings of miscellaneous genres, made with a Pro Tools HDX system and a C24 console, plus several outboards such as Avalon 2022, Chandler Ltd1, Api 512c and Universal Audio 1176. Mixing is done on PMC TB2SA monitors. I don’t have any close neighbours so loudness is not a problem. I’d like to maximize the potential of my instruments by improving the acoustics of the studio. My budget is around €1.000. I hope it was better this time :) Thanks in advance!

OK, thanks, "Both rooms are treated with acoustic sound absorption foam (including bass traps) but there still are some annoying standing waves around and under 100Hz which compromise the acoustic ambience." So you have built these rooms AND treated them already. Can you give us more information on what treatments you have done...maybe some pictures would help of what you have and where you have placed your treatments?

Can you give us more information on what treatments you have done...maybe some pictures would help of what you have and where you have placed your treatments?

Also, an analysis of the room acoustics at present, using REW, to see what the problems are. - Stuart -

Hi guys, I'm back with the pictures and the room analysis report. It's all in the attachments. :mrgreen: If there's something missing just let me know!

If there's something missing just let me know!

The most important part of the spectrum is the low end, between around 20 and 250 Hz. Also, on your waterfall plots, you are showing way too much range on the vertical scale: the only useful part is the drop from the peak level (which should be around 85 dB to 90 dB), until it drops to around 40 dB. Also, the test level looks too low on your graphs: you need to do the tests with an average level of around 85 dB, not at around 60, which is where it seems you did yours. In other words, you need to zoom in on both the vertical and horizontal axes, to show a dB range of roughly 90 down to 40, and a frequency range of roughly 20 Hz to 300 Hz. Also, you don't say which speaker you used for doing those graphs of the control room: Was that the left speaker, or the right speaker? In fact, it would be better to post both sets of graphs, in case there are differences in symmetry. - Stuart -

My thinking is that testing in the hands of the builder is just asking for more of what they may not be able to do.

I've attached the revised analysis file, as suggested. @xSpace: I'm sorry but I didn't understand your last message! Can you explain it to me in other words? Thank you all for your advices! :)

OK, we are getting there! Much better, but your time window is now too long, at 1500 ms! It was fine where it was at 300, but try something like 400 just in case. You also seem to have a lot of ambient noise in there, so you can increase the floor a little, to maybe 50 dB instead of 40. But it's looking like you have some issues there. - Stuart -

Ok this should be the right time :) i hope so... thanks for the patience!!!

AtomShadow wrote:

I've attached the revised analysis file, as suggested. @xSpace: I'm sorry but I didn't understand your last message! Can you explain it to me in other words? Thank you all for your advices! :)

I got my threads mixed up, my bad :) You are in good hands..

What about making an inclined ceiling and change the existing acoustic sound absorption foam with other panels like, for example, Helmholtz Resonator, Acoustic Hangers or Panel Absorbers both in the control and in the live room? Do you think it might be useful to solve these problems?

Is it me or is there a abnormal amount of ringing going on in the low end on those waterfall plots?

Hi dufo, unfortunately you're right... Do you know any possible solutions about that?

That's not ringing. It looks more like modes to me. I'm looking at your SketchUp model, but it shows two rooms with no labels: one is rectangular and measures 4.1 x 2.2 x 2.6 m, and the other is not rectangular. Assuming that the control room is the rectangular one, the first two big peaks and the big dip on your graphs roughly correspond to the first three axial modes (1,0,0 - 0,1,0 - 0,0,1) at 42 Hz., 64 Hz., 78 Hz. The dip at around 85 Hz and the peak at about 125 also match your 2,0,0 and 3,0,0 axial modes almost perfectly. So it seems that you have large modal issues, especially along the room length axis. So you need heavy absorption on your rear wall, and large bass traps in the front and rear corners, both vertical and horizontal. The treatment you have in that room is nowhere near enough for a small room like that. I would put 6 inches (15cm) of 703 on the rear wall, spaced at least 15 cm away, and more if you can, plus full superchunks, floor to ceiling (36 inches (90 cm) across the diagonal face), in both rear corners and both front corners, then measure again to see what else needs doing. Also, what type of foam is that? What are the acoustic characteristics? Please provide a link to the manufacturer's web site, so we can see what that stuff is. - Stuart -

Thanks a lot for all your replies and hints. I've attached another sketchup file where you can see my alternative idea, which is to invert the rooms and place the control room in the bigger one in order to gain space. It being understood that the acoustic treatment is needed anyway, do you think this might improve the quality of sound? P.S. The foam is Auralex "Roominators Project 2 acoustic sound control kit"

which is to invert the rooms and place the control room in the bigger one in order to gain space. It being understood that the acoustic treatment is needed anyway, do you think this might improve the quality of sound?

I would not do that, no. The other room is not symmetrical, and the way you show it in that diagram, you have the speakers aiming across the room (short axis), instead of down the room (long axis). But even then, I still would not use that room as a control room, due to the lack of symmetry. It would be no better than the other one either, acoustically. It has similar issues. Your solution is not about changing rooms: It is about installing the right treatment in the right places. - Stuart -

Ok! I’ll leave things as they are... Would you mind take a look at the pictures and tell me if I understood correctly? I would also like to know if is possible to fit the monitors inside the bass traps in order to gain space... Is there any other way to improve the acoustics without reducing the length of the room of 30 cm? And what can I to correct acoustical problems in the not rectangular room? Thank you!

Yes, that's about right. I guess the corner bass traps could be a bit smaller: They take up a lot of space like that. I had forgotten that your room is so narrow, so you could maybe make them only 60 or 70 cm across the front, instead of 90. Also, if you are planning on mounting the speakers like that, then build proper soffits for them! You can use the bottom interior for bass trapping, using John's design for soffits. - Stuart -

Thank you very much for your reply! What type of fiberglass or rockwool is better for works to be done? I found these: Fiberglass: 15 kg/m3, 5 cm thick 15 kg/m3, 8 cm thick 17 kg/m3, 4.5 cm thick Rock wool: 100 kg/m3, 4 cm thick 40 kg/m3, 5 cm thick 25 kg/m3, 10 cm thick And what can I to correct acoustical problems in the not rectangular room? Excuse me if I insisted on it but a band will start recording soon and i would like to resolve its problems

I'm seriously thinking of making symmetric the live room to make it my control room ... sizes will become: 5.1 meters long, 2.23 wide and 2.66 meters high ... do you think that it would sound good with these dimensions?

I have finished the work of the two rooms, I made the long walls of the old live room parallel and the size of this room are now 5.1 meters long, 2.23 wide and 2.60 meters in height ... I have created, as suggested by Soundman2020, in every corner of the rooms superchunck of 71 cm of length face and for the old control room I've also done the other works recommended. I've attached the revised analysis files. I remind you that now the control room and live room are inverted ... for the use that I do of these environments I have opted for more space in the control room ... Thanks to everyone who will want to comment!

Generally when making an overhead view in Sketchup (or any CAD program) you want to turn the 3D effect off (in Sketchup this would be clicking Parallel Projection on the camera menu). It appears to me from your sketch, that your monitors are mounted at a very poor angle making the "sweet spot" somewhere over your desk as opposed to the usual LP. You need to change the angle of your front soffitwall/traps.