psiligoose studio project

Greetings all. I have been lurking around this site now for close to 10 years. I am finally in a position to build something so I am taking the plunge to look for some advice. Where am I? I am located in the suburbs of Boston, MA. USA. Cold in the winter and hot in the summer! What am I attempting to do? I am about to build a new construction building where my garage stands. Because of various setback and grandfathered restrictions on the building and where it sits on the property I am committed to the footprint I currently have in the design. The new building will have a 27’ x 20’ live room with a 15’ ceiling and a control room that’s 18’ x 15’ with an 11 ft ceiling. Those are internal dimensions to the face of the 2x6 stud. What I am looking for is advice on the control room design within those dimensions. Live room will have to wait, as I just don’t have the budget to do much with it. I may have to simply sheetrock it with one leaf and put down a few rugs until such time that a budget is available. Where am I right now in the project? I have full architecture plans for the shell of the building and the foundation work will be done by 4/27. The building construction starts 5/6 and should be weather tight by 5/13. I have done some building prior including soundproofing of a previous basement studio room. I have all the required tools and more than enough confidence so I will be doing all the subsequent work myself once the building reaches that stage. How loud am I? In the control room I like to keep it to manageable levels, around 80 to 85 dB I am guessing as I do not have a sound level meter. I do like to crank it at times to bask in the glory but most of the time I am trying to conserve what’s left of my hearing. In the live room it can get loud. I play all styles but Rock is predominate and my friends and associates lean towards playing loudly so good isolation between the CR and the LR is crucial. Distance to the next property is far enough away for it not to be a major concern and even though one corner of the building will be 22’ from the road it is not a main st. and sees mostly sparse local traffic. Proximity to the nearest highway is about 2 miles. Actually my biggest outside noise concern is the dogs across the street. Luckily they are in the house by 6:30 on most nights. What do I record? Loud Rock, acoustic jazz, pop, voice over. Soft to loud and everything in between. My main instrument is drums. What is my budget I am spending 45k to put up the building on a new foundation and spray foam the roof deck and gable triangles. Fiberglass in the 2x6 walls. HVAC will be a split system with the air handler in the attic space above the live room feeding baffled boxes. Beyond that I hope to focus on the control room and hope to spend no more than 5k to treat it. What’s it made of? The floor will be a 6” concrete slab laid on gravel with 2” foam board between. Walls are 2x6 wood with ¾ plywood sheathing and ½ shiplap over that. Interior walls will be sheetrock with some form of treatment over them. What questions do I have? 1. Based on the internal dimensions of the unfinished CR 18’ L x 15’ W x 11’ H, what would my best approach be? I have no large monitors to soffit mount but would not like to rule out a future that includes them. There will be a window into the live room at the front of the room which is 6’L x 3’H. should I angle that window? My thoughts are to build a floating room within the CR with as little space between walls as possible. Using one of the designs on this site I have created a (very) rough sketchup. I am thinking some kind of false ceiling with fabric covered 703 rather than making the ceiling the full 11’. How high should I make it based on the dimensions I have? Should it be flat or have a slope? Since I haven’t built anything yet I have time to change my thoughts. As you can see in the sketch there is a hallway leading to the live room which passes through a small booth and a machine room. Anyway I will be posting more info as I draw more, read more, imagine more.

Hi "psiligoose" (love the handle! :)) and welcome!!! A couple of comments about that layout: Firstly, your inner-leaf walls are splayed the wrong way: the room should be narrower at the front, and wider at the back. You should probably fix that. If you are going for an RFZ design then you'll need to splay each wall at least 6 degrees, and most likely more than that, but if you are only after dealing with flutter echo, then 6° is enough. Or you could also go with straight walls (not splayed). Either way will work. Next, that "corridor through several rooms from CR to LR" does not look like a practical solution to me. That will get tired real quick, as you have to open and close multiple doors to get from one room to the other. I'd re-think that approach. Next: I don't see much room for bass trapping in the vertical corners on that design...

I have no large monitors to soffit mount but would not like to rule out a future that includes them.

What monitors are you planning to use in there? If you are thinking of soffit mounting in the future, then you might as well do it now with whatever you have, and use Barefoot's design to make it easy to swap them out later. Trying to retrofit soffits a year or two down the line is going to be a major PITA, but if you do it now it's just a bit of extra work. Plus the benefits ate well worth it, many times over. IMHO.

There will be a window into the live room at the front of the room which is 6’L x 3’H. should I angle that window?

Yes no maybe. ! :) It all depends: If you angle the glass then that means you reduce the isolation between rooms, since you'll have a narrower gap in one place. On the other hand, if you don't angle the glass then you might end up with annoying glare from your lights, reflected in the glass. Careful planning of your lighting might help with that. Or you could angle it anyway and just use thicker glass to compensate. Yes no maybe.... :)

My thoughts are to build a floating room within the CR

What do you mean by "floating room"? Are you talking about floating your floor and the entire room on top of it? If so, that's a major expense: do you really need that? Or are you just talking about normal 2-leaf decoupled MSM construction?

I am thinking some kind of false ceiling with fabric covered 703 rather than making the ceiling the full 11’. How high should I make it based on the dimensions I have?

I would make it as high as you possibly can, and build inside out if you want to go with the 703. More height is practically always good, acoustically. If you have 11 feet up there, then make the most of it!

Should it be flat or have a slope?

Yes no maybe.... :) Once again, it depends on what you are trying to achieve, and also on personal preference. For RFZ and/or flutter echo control, then yes, tilt it. But if you are not going the RFZ route, your flutter is already taken care of with the 703 up there, so in that case you could leave it flat.... - Stuart -

First of all thanks Soundman 2020 for responding! So nice to hear an echo back when you scream.

Firstly, your inner-leaf walls are splayed the wrong way:

DOA! that should give you some insight to how my brain stores data (backwards and upside down) duly noted, I will fix up my drawing asap including a 6 degree angle which should take care of the front wall looking so weird as well as open the front corners for some bass trapping. And speaking of which, not that I was thinking of this for the CR but perhaps more for the LR; have you read this paper by the BBC on modular bass trap design? and if so what do you all think? http://downloads.bbc.co.uk/rd/pubs/reports/1992-10.pdf I find it fascinating that the simplest designs most often perform the best.

Next, that "corridor through several rooms from CR to LR" does not look like a practical solution to me

again duly noted, unfortunately as tired as I may become traveling down that hallway I would only have the doors closed when someone was in the iso booth section and frankly that would be infrequently. Also I need some way to get from the CR to the LR and taking my building placement and property restrictions into consideration, as well as multiple iterations of the layout design, it was either that or go outside to get to the LR. I also feel the need for an isolated machine/workbench/electrical breaker/storage space without encroaching on the LR which is kinda sacred to me. (first love is playing in a nice open space) I have kinda made my peace with it.

Next: I don't see much room for bass trapping in the vertical corners on that design...

good point, hopefully my next, more excellent (less lame) drawing will show some...

If you are thinking of soffit mounting in the future, then you might as well do it now with whatever you have

sold! (see how easy that was) suddenly I am very excited about soffit mounted speakers even though I don't have anything to put there except maybe an old pair of AR 3As which will probably sound better than they ever have in that placement. Next drawing will work it in. Glass::: I hear you, here's the part of the story that you prolly won't like. I have 2 (salvaged) double pane glass doors 3x6. You know, thin glass, vacuum sealed in between. They are free vs $700 for solid panes. My budget is tiny and later if I think they are causing me problems I will replace but for now that is what I believe I will use. so tilted towards me right?

What do you mean by "floating room"? Are you talking about floating your floor and the entire room on top of it?

yeah that's what I was thinking. I have a boatload of 2x4s from the garage that I took apart nail by nail that I can use for everything from floor framing to walls. The only additional cost I see is overhead joists and of course whatever it is I would use to float the floor (neoprene). That is the real additional cost as far as I see (correct me if I am missing something) Not to say that I have my mind set, I have little no when it comes to better ideas that make more sense than what I am currently thinking and, well, cheaper is better in this case. IOW feel free to try and talk me out of it.

If you have 11 feet up there, then make the most of it!

ok, I was thinking I would bring it down low enough to put some effective bass trapping up there but really leaving only enough space for AC ductwork is an interesting idea. I love tall ceilings.

For RFZ and/or flutter echo control, then yes, tilt it.

yeah that's what I was thinking RFX LEDE, and your thoughts about lighting placement are very helpful. I hadn't put much energy into that and of course I should be thinking about it. It is so nice to have feedback, thank you for your time and patience. I will follow up soon...taka later