Here's a picture of a room empty.
Here is a picture I made of where I plan to hang these panels.
I made them different colors because I think the different
colors correspond to the different types they should be.
BLUE: 3" deep wood frame with 4" BATT on top of the frame.(rather than inside the frame).
GREEN: 3" deep wood frame with 4" BATT inside the frame.
ORANGE: 3" deep wood frame with 2" BATT inside the frame.
The little sphere toward the front is the mixing position.
If there's a guru with a spare minute, can you tip me off as to which of these
should be how thick, and how distant from the wall? :)
Thanks a hundred million in advance :)
Help with this?
Originally posted at johnlsayers.com, topic 15778.
go with all 4" insulation inside the 3" frame. this way you can "mass produce" them. in the corners, consider stacking pink insulation behind the absorbers which span the corner. a couple of 1x1 strips vertically to hold some cloth and plastic and stack it like a super chunk using pink insulation. otherwise it looks like a plan!
What Glenn said!
The only thing I'd maybe add is some absorption on the front wall, directly behind your speakers.
Based on your previous comments, I guess this is your TOTAL plan, not your US$ 250 plan? That will take a bit more than US$ 250 to complete.
- Stuart -
AWESOME!
Stu- I was literally seconds away from clicking the "buy now" button at an online that was asking $50 for 6 batts w shipping. As a last try, I did a search for a local place that might carry the stuff. I found the 2" 703's at $6.00 each! The crate of 12 was $96. It's a ten minute drive from here too, man. I drove home itchy as all hell and smiling like a crazy person.lol. THE WOOD, however, and the burlap covering: these items want a bite from the budget. But out of obsession I laid half me food money down for the first wooden frame last night and built it in the wee hours of the morning. It's addicting. As for the many online vids: there's reall nothing like seeing it done, albeit a hundred different ways. Could you believe $6 per BATT? Anyone interested in buyin? Figure in the shipping it might work out for ya!Based on your previous comments, I guess this is your TOTAL plan, not your US$ 250 plan? That will take a bit more than US$ 250 to complete. - Stuart -
That's pretty good pricing!!!! :shock: Lucky you! If you look around, you might be able to come up with good pricing on wood as well. Search the forum to see how some folks have built theirs, and you might get ideas... :)
No ya didn't! There's a saying here on the forum: "No pics means it didn't happen". :) Where are the pics???? Seriously, it's good when people post their pics for several reasons. It helps others to see what can be done, and it might also help you, if someone here notices something you did that could be improved. - Stuart -for the first wooden frame last night and built it in the wee hours of the morning.
I KNEW you were gonna say that!!!
I just took front and back pics with the phone. Will upload
them tomorrow!! Funny.
I was so eager to finish the first one and have no burlap.
So I went around the house breathing into everything to test
for airflow. Let's just say "I hope she didnt plan on using
those curtains again." (not even kidding lol).
Mike
It needs to be mentioned that, if anybody has any doubt
whether even one of these things will affect a room's
acoustics: it is 100% noticeable. Even this ONE. It's detectable
by the ear that "the dead spot is 'right there'."
Man I can just imagine how sweet a fully treated room sounds.
:shock: :!:Let's just say "I hope she didnt plan on using those curtains again."
:shock: :shock: :shock: :!:(not even kidding lol).
Aren't you glad that you stayed around and didn't quit? :) - Stuart -it is 100% noticeable. Even this ONE. It's detectable by the ear that "the dead spot is 'right there'."
I'm never gonna quit.
The curtains thing is true by the way. I might have built
the world's prettiest broadband absorber panel.
Also, I did something in an attempt to get a spectral
reading of my room and I'm hoping you could yay or nay
it's viability. I'll make a new post in another thread about it.
Photos to come...
PLEASE clarify what this part means^in the corners, consider stacking pink insulation behind the absorbers which span the corner. a couple of 1x1 strips vertically to hold some cloth and plastic and stack it like a super chunk using pink insulation. otherwise it looks like a plan!
What Glenn is saying is that you can improve the effectiveness of the diagonal traps across the corners by also adding ordinary pink fluffy fiberglass behind them, in the triangular space behind them. You can use the concept of the "superchunk" bass trap for that (use the search button on the forum to find out alllll about superchunks), and one good way of hiding the ugly fiberglass in the corner is with a simple frame made from 1" x 1" wood, which holds plastic sheeting over the fiberglass, and cloth over the plastic sheeting. (The plastic is to prevent the device from taking too much of the highs and mids out of the room: you want to treat the room, not kill it! Small rooms need a lot of bass trapping, but a side effect of bass traps is that they also kill the mids and highs, but if you cover some of them with plastic then that reflects the mids and highs back into the room where you want them, and only lets the bass through to be "trapped").
- Stuart -
Jumping in here with a THANKS to Stuart (again). You just clarified superchunks for me and the "why" of plastic sheething over them.
:) !
- Stuart -
Jumping in here with thanks to Stuart also.
For the same thing and for a hundred other things.
:D
Plastic over the corner absorbers to keep the highs alive.
Dude, you ROCK! :yahoo:go with all 4" insulation inside the 3" frame. this way you can "mass produce" them. in the corners, consider stacking pink insulation behind the absorbers which span the corner. a couple of 1x1 strips vertically to hold some cloth and plastic and stack it like a super chunk using pink insulation. otherwise it looks like a plan!
I'm going to use metal corner bead for the cloud and the Wall-Ceiling corners.
Wood frame at front and back.
Glenn's superchunk for the 4 corners.
And a membrane to treat the 120Hz peak :wink:
I still owe Stu a picture of the first absorber, coming as soon as I'm
on a hardwired computer (I'm tapping the wi-fi at a gas station on an ipad right now).
Consider a pair of angled membrane panels so you create some angles front and back plus shift mode behavior a bit.
Why would you do that? The metal corner bead is to keep the outside corners (wall-2-wall) rigid with a straight clean vertical line it is not intended or recommended to use it @ wall-2-ceiling corners. In your final layer, use mud and tape, standard procedure :)I'm going to use metal corner bead for the cloud and the Wall-Ceiling corners.
After looking at the way a membrane absorber works, the
angled front is making perfect sense.
I'm wondering: suppose the widest part of that angle(the
part that protrudes furthest into the room) has a membrane
thickness which targets a particular frequency...
As the angle slopes inward toward the back of the absorber
unit, is it then absorbing gradually Higher frequencies
or gradually Lower ones?
The metal corner bead: it's only going onto the
ones at the side wall primary reflection points. The back
of the unit is 2"x2" furring strip frame with corner bead
providing rigidity to the corners of the Batts.
I do feel a bit uneasy having a metallic skeleton like that.
But it was ultra-price-happy, and the only wood needed for
the design is the spacer/frame that anchors to the wall.
Praying that I'm not about to hang the equivalent of
cymbals on the walls...
How I wish i had internet in the room so I could upload the
pictures as it goes. I'm takin the pics though and will get them
in here when Im at the library:)
Here goes painting.... :wink:
So you are not talking about using the metal corner bead at the wall-ceiling corners of the existing sheetrock....you are saying you will use it on the cloud....
The way you jambed all those words together...it still reads like your using it on the sheetrock...even with an explanation.
Just for clouds.
After starting a frame last night using
cornerBead and some rivets...
It's kind of like working with razor blades.
It is a great concept and I hope it works out.
But it's all wood from here on, without a doubt.
I don't 100% trust the metal riveted seams.
Imagine all of them are hung and mounted and
one day you hear "bzzzzzz" coming from one seam
on one of them: I'm already a nerveball.
Wood seems naturally warmer to me.
hmm ... I built 10 [so far] absorbers using the metal corner bead & rivets.
Using 2 rivets per connection, no chance to buzz. They are surprisingly sturdy.
What I also like about them is the weight compared to wood frames. I measure
about 5 - 8 lbs. This may be a factor when it comes time to figuring out how
they'll get hung on walls & ceiling.
... just my 1/2 cent.
Brother thats a good 1/2 cent.
The price difference between the beads and
lumber would save me a good hundred clams.
Good to know they're STURDY.
In the ones I saw online, the guy used
hook eyes and cable to suspend them.
This is the link for the design/construction that I followed. http://www.radford.edu/shelm/acoustics/ ... #Broadband This was my first time working with this material, and his guides were very helpful ! As you mentioned, it's like working with razor blades :shock: I did buy some useful tools to help: 1. Get a good pair of metal shear cutters. 2. I found a 'guide bracket' that helps maintain a right angle for the corners. 3. Bought a couple of small needle-nose vice grips. They were a couple bucks each, but they give you the extra fingers [hands] to hold everything while you rivet. 4. AND ... a good rivet gun! Do the double rivet/connection. File down any sharp edges. Wear GLOVES ! When you start building these things, they are flimsy as all get out ... but as you continue, you'll see them get better. Once you put the corner spacer on [mine were for 4" thick panels], a big improvement happens. When you finally add the 2 sheets of 2'x4'x2" panels ... then mount the top of the cage, using the needle-nose to hold them together ... get your rivets in ... if you do it properly, you'll find that you can roll these things around the room! They are surprisingly sturdy. I still have to cover mine with batting, and then the final fabric ... in the meantime, I have them leaning against the CR walls JUST so that I can stand being in the room :mrgreen: Once I get my walls finished, and then get the flooring put on ... I'm looking forward to adding the 'chunky corner traps'. I'm curious to hear what affect they'll have on the room. Wishing you the best! SincerelyBrother thats a good 1/2 cent. The price difference between the beads and lumber would save me a good hundred clams. Good to know they're STURDY. In the ones I saw online, the guy used hook eyes and cable to suspend them.