Old basement new studio

Hey all, First time caller long time listener :lol: Been lurking here for over three years now. And finally have a project to put to the test. My grandson has come of age and ready to record some music with his buddies. And being the proud gramps I have decided to help him out with his dream. We are upstate in the rural country side and have no neighbors to contend with. I have an old guest house with a basement below. The footprint is 20'x40' and no obstructions. The only probelm is the ceiling height is about 7'6". I have decided to dig out the basement and pour a new slab to gain some height. I am not sure how deep yet just becuase I have no idea what lies underneath the slab The foundation/walls have some issues and I will need to support it with new footings. Plus remove the existing paint and water proof it from the inside. I will also install an interior drain system with a sump. After all is said and done it will leave me with a 18' x 40' floor plan to work with. I do understand the MAM system and will be using that technique. I still have some equiptment and good contacts from my former days as a general contractor and will use as many resources I have at my disposal. My budget is approx. $50k I will do most of the work myself with the help of my grandson and his friends. We plan on building a Control room, a live room and a isolation booth. My question to all is... Will the dimensions of the room/s translate into a good acousticly driven enviroment.. I have looked at JS's drawings and feel this one will work well for us. I would appreciate any feedback you can offer Respectfully, John D

welcome! very nice present there gramps! :) if you have the option to dig out so the space is 10' from slat to upper joists, then you could put in a nice 9' high ceiling all around. plus have plenty of room for the HVAC ducts etc. the design you picked is a nice one and should be able to be readily sized to your space.

Glenn, Thanks for the feedback. Although you think its for him. Its really for me so I can see more of him. :) But I am also a music fanatic and can't wait to help with recording ,mixing and whatever they might need. Grandkids are the best. You can send them home when you get tired. Like I said its an old house. It still has wood heating upstairs and no duct work to worrry about in the basement. A few water pipes and such, but easy to re-route the few pipes that are in the way. I am hoping for a minimum of 9' but will go for more if I can. I need to see how the soil is underneath the existing slab. It is a damp basement and I want to make sure there are no moisture issues and where the sewer line goes before I will determine my depth/height. In JS's drawing it looks like a 90 degree listening position. Or that it falls past the 38%. Do you have a preference over 60 or 90 degrees? Respectfully, John D

"Plus remove the existing paint and water proof it from the inside." And the outside...that is where the problems are always located, we just see the inside and think it can be fixed with the minimum amount of effort :)

Well Brien you are absolutely correct about that. But digging out eight feet of dirt around the perimeter of the house to most would seem somewhat extreme, don't you think? And minimum amount of effort you say? What you should have asked is, How I am going to install and what preperation am I doing. What experience or knowledge do you have in this area? Sand blast for prep and spray/brush on a Cementitious crystaline waterproofing product Xpex. But since most of my life was spent waterproofing clarifiers and weir walls in the water reclamation industry and building high rise commercial buildings with subterranean parking I think I have a grip on it partner. Xpex has been around for over thirty years and I was/am a certified installer. I've watched your post's on other people's threads and you tend to come off a little heavy handed. Slow down man. Life is too short. Most of these people are trying to build a studio not re-invent the wheel. And of course we all want to do it correctly. But most of these people are new to construction and come here to learn. Not get chastised. Ask a question, opposed to making statements that are not always correct. It will save some of these arguments you get started, and make your posts more appealing to read. Just my two cents Respectfully, John D

John Dewers wrote:

In JS's drawing it looks like a 90 degree listening position. Or that it falls past the 38%. Do you have a preference over 60 or 90 degrees?

i think its 60° it's just the seating position is close to 50% because if (for example) you were to go to 5.1 (and who isn't? :)) then adding the requisite monitors on stands would rapidly get you there. that said, once you have your raw space completed we can do some more detailed work to make sure the dimensions are right and it fits where you have stairs, utilities, etc.

"I've watched your post's on other people's threads and you tend to come off a little heavy handed. Slow down man. Life is too short. Most of these people are trying to build a studio not re-invent the wheel." Sir...you and people like you need to understand...this ain't no game....you mess it up...and your money goes in the toilet..and the people that you trusted...look like idiots. I'm heavy handed because I build stuff that stays around for years...not a few weeks and it is ALL insurable and passes DADE COUNTY inspections. Now you figure that with the world wide environment that John Sayers Forum reaches....Chile...Australia, Africa., the Netherlands, Canada...you pick a country this forum has dealt with it...and the obstacles are many in reference to building something that stays up and doesn't cost as much as a hack might make it cost due to inexperience. "And of course we all want to do it correctly. But most of these people are new to construction and come here to learn. Not get chastised." This is why I am working on a...what should I call it..a book or a manual...I do not know at this point what to call it. But it is due to this lack of experience in construction first...the moth to the light effect of an audio environment build second and complete inability to construct anything...last...and that is the most important thing to be remembered out of everything I just mentioned. "Well Brien you are absolutely correct about that. But digging out eight feet of dirt around the perimeter of the house to most would seem somewhat extreme, don't you think?" No sir...it happens here first....this is your first line of defense...it isn't an area to quit on because it is hard to do...it is a requirement. Let me say this John...I do not know what you do but I protect people from making mistakes...even if I make a mistake myself in that attempt.

xSpace wrote:

"I've watched your post's on other people's threads and you tend to come off a little heavy handed. Slow down man. Life is too short. Most of these people are trying to build a studio not re-invent the wheel." Sir...you and people like you need to understand...this ain't no game....you mess it up...and your money goes in the toilet..and the people that you trusted...look like idiots. I'm heavy handed because I build stuff that stays around for years...not a few weeks and it is ALL insurable and passes DADE COUNTY inspections. Now you figure that with the world wide environment that John Sayers Forum reaches....Chile...Australia, Africa., the Netherlands, Canada...you pick a country this forum has dealt with it...and the obstacles are many in reference to building something that stays up and doesn't cost as much as a hack might make it cost due to inexperience. "And of course we all want to do it correctly. But most of these people are new to construction and come here to learn. Not get chastised." This is why I am working on a...what should I call it..a book or a manual...I do not know at this point what to call it. But it is due to this lack of experience in construction first...the moth to the light effect of an audio environment build second and complete inability to construct anything...last...and that is the most important thing to be remembered out of everything I just mentioned. "Well Brien you are absolutely correct about that. But digging out eight feet of dirt around the perimeter of the house to most would seem somewhat extreme, don't you think?" No sir...it happens here first....this is your first line of defense...it isn't an area to quit on because it is hard to do...it is a requirement. Let me say this John...I do not know what you do but I protect people from making mistakes...even if I make a mistake myself in that attempt.

So where can I see pictures of your finished studio builds? Would love to see them. JD

gullfo wrote:

John Dewers wrote:

In JS's drawing it looks like a 90 degree listening position. Or that it falls past the 38%. Do you have a preference over 60 or 90 degrees?

i think its 60° it's just the seating position is close to 50% because if (for example) you were to go to 5.1 (and who isn't? :)) then adding the requisite monitors on stands would rapidly get you there. that said, once you have your raw space completed we can do some more detailed work to make sure the dimensions are right and it fits where you have stairs, utilities, etc.

Thanks Glenn, The stair access is from outside. and no obstrucions in the entire space except for some plumbing that is being re-routed. The boys were in the basement Monday cleaning all the crap out of there and I have a crew geared up for Monday to do the demo work. As soon as I have some pictures to show I will get them posted Thanks again, JD

John Dewers wrote:

But digging out eight feet of dirt around the perimeter of the house to most would seem somewhat extreme, don't you think?

Depends on how much moisture you are dealing with. If you have 50K you might consider hiring a backhoe operator for a quote. One thing that is going to limit how much deeper you dig the floor down is how high the water table is. If you build the floor in the dry season, and find out it is below the water table in the wet season, there is no sump pump or water sealer that will be able to keep it dry. Also, it might sound easy to dig down a few feet, but when you have to haul the dirt out by hand in buckets it becomes a major undertaking. I started out with a half basement and figured that it would take me a few weekends to dig the other half. It took one day every weekend for a year. I felt like I was in "Shawshank Redemption". Then I had the house lifted a few feet and poured a new basement floor on top of the old slab. That was the only way to get head room without getting into the water table. All new footings and foundation walls, all sealed inside and out. New perimeter drain system going into sump. Haven't seen a single drop of water in there since. Now, I'm just about ready to start buying some studio construction supplies as soon as the permits clear. So anyway, "somewhat extreme" is all relative. :) Munk