Dedicated Heavy Music Studio Design Questions

Hi Guys, I am hoping you wonderful chaps could help me to not make too many school boy errors in my upcoming studio build. :D I am currently based in the UK, but am about to embark on my first studio build in Montana (US) (long & dull story) I only record loud metal bands & bands fly into record with me, having done 60+ albums I know what I like & dislike about the studio I work from at the moment, and probably have some odd things on my wish list. :oops: Budget wise, it's how I make my living and to a certain extent, it costs what it costs, I could well be working from this place for the next 20 years, I will just have to get over it, but having said that, I also like eating & sleeping indoors & there is no point wasting money unnecessarily... Every $1k I save is $1k I dont have to earn. The plan is to buy & install a prefab steel building (concrete bass) and build the studio inside that (with the chill out, catering & accommodation in a second steel building). The plot I am buying will have a minimum of 30 acres & will be in a remote location. (My house will also be there though...) And the internal walls will be wood frame isolated drywall as recommended here (http://johnlsayers.com/Recmanual/Titles/Acoustics3.htm) The studio building is to have the following rooms:- Control room Main Control Room patched into live rooms. Centered around an Argosy AURA.260-LR (or 520-LR) (http://www.argosyconsole.com/documentat ... tSheet.pdf ) 86.5” x 51.75” for AURA.260-LR 111” x 51.75” for AURA.520-LR Both include 36U of rack space Editing room Secondary smaller room for drum & mix editing based on an Argosy Aura.260-N (includes 14U of rack space under desk) Live Room Large room with high ceilings for recording drums, guitar amps, vocals & guitar (all separately to a click, nothing is ever tracked simultaneously) Machine Room No sound isolation required, very small room, with faraday cage built into walls and maybe some cooling if practical) Amp Head Room (maybe a shared section of the machine room) No sound isolation required, very small room, with faraday cage built into walls and maybe some cooling if practical) Equipment Storage Room No sound isolation required, just for storage of cabs, heads, mic stands, flight cases etc Maintenance Workshop No sound isolation required, room will a small electronics workshop to house O-scopes, function generators, soldering gear etc, etc I am currently trying to knock up some plans in Sketchup to help me visualise everything, I have been reading through the FAQ's but I might have some silly questions where I have missed some things, apologies in advance if I am being annoying... :oops: Firstly I was trying to lay out the live room, I wanted to follow the 'ideals' something around 24 x 20 (internal) seems good for my purposes & I want something a lot higher than the current room I record in as that drives me insane, say 12 foot high... Using the 1.00 1.60 2.33 ideal that gives me H12' x W19' - 2 3/8" x L27' - 11 1/2" which seems just perfect to my tiny brain. My first two problems are these, I want to give the room an odd shape so I don't have parallel reflections, which shape is best, how does this affect my dimensions. I also (think I) want a peaked roof, does this screw with the 1.00 1.60 2.33 ideal? surly it must in some way? How does that affect my dimensions? My second big question is this control room, I don't want to re-invent the wheel here, there must be a perfect shape & size for this that some clever chap has already done the math on, but I can't seem to find any info (I think after 4 days of reading here I am starting to go information blind lol) Many thanks to any one that that takes the time to reply.. Nick P.S. If this seems familiar, posted it in the Build Forum a few days ago before realising this was a more appropriate place & deleting it from there & re-posting here.. Sorry.. ---------------------------- Edit for yet another question:- The metal prefab building will have a concrete floor, from what I have read this is not too terrible, I have read here that floating floors are probably not a great idea for this kind of building, but I would like Hardwood floors for looks & durability, is it still possible to pull this off ?(if I could have cable runs under the floor, even better)

Righty :) This is where I am up to with another day of reading & a lot of bad math :oops: Working on my ideal (1.00 1.60 2.33) H12' x W19' - 2 3/8" x L27' - 11 1/2" I drew my W19' - 2 3/8" x L27' - 11 1/2" box & added 12deg peaks to two of the walls, I measured between the peak & each existing wall & halved that figure on each to average out the peaked walls so I wouldn't loose my 'ideal 1.00 1.60 2.33 ratio' But looking at the picture below, I can't help thinking my math/method is flawed. Here are my workings:- 12 deg peak to existing wall center on W19' - 2 3/8" is 2' 1/2" ((2' 1/2") /2) = 1' 1/4" 12 deg peak to existing wall center on L27' - 11 1/2" is 2' 11 11/16" ((2' 11 11/16") /2) = 1' - 5 7/8" So to average the 12 deg peak walls the dimensions are :- W18' - 2 1/8" L26' - 5 5/8" Pic A I am using the original dimensions to take the 12 deg line from Pic B I am using the new smaller compensated dimensions In all honesty, I don't think either drawing is correct Someone please put me out of my misery & tell me how you are actually meant to work this out correctly :cry:

???? Is this for the control room? Start with a rectangle with the golden rule as th inside dimension. Then about a year later start worrying about adding slat walls @ 6 degrees. :D Corner traps @ 45......... If your talking live room, then that shape might be fine. Whole building layout doesn't need to follow the golden rule. I'll draw a skp for you tomorrow.

What size is the pre-fab buildings foot print? What is the wall height of this building? And what is the roof pitch (in degrees) of the pre-fab building?

Firstly, thank you so much for the reply, your help is really appreciated! :)

lilith_envy wrote:

???? Is this for the control room?

Sorry I should have been much, much clearer, :oops: No, this is the 'Live Room', I buried that info in the middle of a load of rambling in my first post. Lesson learned, I will label my drawings from here on in, I was a bit tired :oops: See Below:-

NickH wrote:

Firstly I was trying to lay out the live room, I wanted to follow the 'ideals' something around 24 x 20 (internal) seems good for my purposes & I want something a lot higher than the current room I record in as that drives me insane, say 12 foot high... Using the 1.00 1.60 2.33 ideal that gives me H12' x W19' - 2 3/8" x L27' - 11 1/2" which seems just perfect to my tiny brain.

lilith_envy wrote:

Whole building layout doesn't need to follow the golden rule.

I wasn't planning to do every room with an idea ratio, just the Live Room, Control Room & Editing Room, I have the space, so I figured 'Why not...' :wink:

lilith_envy wrote:

What size is the pre-fab buildings foot print? What is the wall height of this building? And what is the roof pitch (in degrees) of the pre-fab building?

My naive plan was to buy the pre fab building to fit my ideal studio layout, not the other way round. You can have them built to any size within reason, although it is cheaper to use one of the standard off the shelf ones The wall heights are usually either 10', 12', 14' or 16'. At the moment the 14' is looking a good size. Roof pitch on nearly all of them is: 1:12 (4.76 degrees) (although I don't intend my internal studio roof to be using a lot of that space, I though I could keep it free for HVAC pipes etc. The pre fab, will have 6" of heat insulation all round (it is Montana after all lol) How far away do I need to keep the 'sound' rooms from the external pre fab walls to stop them becoming a 3rd leaf? Many thanks Nick

you can always build an inner shell to the right sizes so long as you remember to ensure the shell is a single leaf with enough mass to be part of the isolation.

Hi, Thanks for replying Gulfo!

gullfo wrote:

you can always build an inner shell to the right sizes so long as you remember to ensure the shell is a single leaf with enough mass to be part of the isolation.

Sorry, I am being a little dull witted here, is this in refrence to the studio being built in the metal prefab building or my ideal room maths problem? Many thanks Nick

both. one - you'll want your outer shell to have enough mass to act as part of the MSM system (walls and roof) (metal prefab), and your inner shell can be optimized for purpose (math problem).

gullfo wrote:

both. one - you'll want your outer shell to have enough mass to act as part of the MSM system (walls and roof) (metal prefab), and your inner shell can be optimized for purpose (math problem).

Ahh, thank you! Will I still have good isolation between my live room & my control room if the prefab wall is one of the leaves or is that only relevant on the walls that are next to an external (pre-fab) wall? I still can't work out how to get the math right when on the ideal rooms without having the walls parallel though. Am I understanding lilith_envy correctly that the best acoustic approach is to make a rectangular room to the 'ideal' ratio and then use (fake) slat walls to solve the parallel refection problems? Do I use the same technique for the peaked roof? If not, how on earth do not loose my 'ideal' ratio by adding the 12deg peaks. Lastly, lilith_envy mentioned 6 deg, have I misunderstood when reading here that 12deg is better & 6 might not be sufficient? Many thanks & sorry for all the questions :oops: Nick

Is this better if I put slat walls in where I have the 4 x 2's & have a slat peaked roof at 12 deg? Thanks Nick

Is this a plan view or side view? Yes, the rectangle is easier to compute but that's only part of the effort. You mentioned the isolation between rooms. The rooms will be separated by double leafs walls. The slats can be the means to break up the parallel surfaces and should be 12 degrees or more if possible because (depending on the room size) 6 degrees might not be enough.

gullfo wrote:

Is this a plan view or side view?

Plan view (Top down) Thanks Nick

you can use a series of smaller slat walls and this way you can reduce the overall depth needed. you can mix and match the treatments as well between absorbers and polys if that addresses the desired acoustics.

gullfo wrote:

you can use a series of smaller slat walls and this way you can reduce the overall depth needed. you can mix and match the treatments as well between absorbers and polys if that addresses the desired acoustics.

Excellent, thanks! I will alter the design to have 4 12 deg angles per wall instead of the two I have now, should be a big space saver :D Will this effect bass trapping in any way? Can I use the same slat construction on the ceiling? (See below) Thanks Nick

so the smaller units will have less space in those for bass trapping but you can use the ceiling for hangers and use the slats in sections where you need the reflection and that range of absorption. and not everything on the walls will be slats - you will likely need a balance of other absorption there as well. or even reversible treatments.