good materials to use when isolation is not an issue?

I'm working hard to convince my friends/band members to build a dedicated jam, tracking and mixing room. We live in a remote area of Australia and will most likely build the room as a stand-alone unit on a farm. Basically there will be no issue with sound getting out (no neighbours for 10 or 20kms) and only a minor issue of sound getting in (only the sounds of wind and rain will be noises I can think of that might cause a slight issue) so I believe that sound isolation is not an issue. If I am missing something please let me know. :? With this in mind, what sorts of materials would be "good" for us to use when building walls/floor/ceiling? Would there be much difference in how the room will sound whether we use wood for the walls compared to gyprock/plasterboard? Our budget is on the lower end... maybe $10-$15,000 australian... so if we do use wood, it'll probably be cheap stuff!

a dedicated jam, tracking and mixing room.

That sounds like three rooms to me. In which case isolation is an issue: If you have excellent isolation through the wall and window between your control room and your "jam" room (JR), but poor isolation to the outside, then you will have poor isolation overall, as the sound that gets out through the JR outside wall will come right back in through the CR outside wall. . . If you isolate rooms from each other, that includes isolating them from the outside world too, otherwise the "outside world" becomes a flanking path for sound, and is your weakest link. On the other hand, if you build just one room to be both jam, tracking and control room all-in-one, then you might find it hard to track well, since you'll be hearing the direct sound of the instruments rather than just what the mics are picking up, and you might also find it hard to mix well, unless you take the drums and other acoustic instruments outside, since they will resonate sympathetically as you mix, thus distorting what you hear in the room. Also, mixing rooms (control rooms) need to be absolutely symmetrical, while live rooms, tracking rooms, jam rooms, etc. are usually built asymmetrically. Yes, many people on a tight budget or with a very small space do build a single room to do everything, but if you do that then you need to be aware of the consequences. I'm not sure how expensive building materials are where you live, but AU$ 15k sounds like it should be enough to do something basic and decent. Maybe two rooms, instead of three? Perhaps just one control room, and one live / jam room? How much space to you have available for this project? What shape? What type of music / instruments? Is this a commercial venture, to make money out if in the future, or just a place for musicians to hang out, play and record for fun?

Thanks Soundman! It's obvious now that my original post was a bit vague. By "a dedicated jam, tracking and mixing room" I do mean one single room that will cater for all three activities (play, track & mix). Currently we are a bit nomadic... we sometimes practise in the town hall, sometimes in the footy club, sometimes in houses that are vacant. It works ok but can be a pain in the rectum moving all the gear in and out each time we play. So by "dedicated" I meant a room that is for the express purpose of worshipping the sweet sounds of music. And maybe for drinking beer :roll:

How much space to you have available for this project? What shape? What type of music / instruments? Is this a commercial venture, to make money out if in the future, or just a place for musicians to hang out, play and record for fun?

Space is not an issue... the one thing we have a lot of out here is space! We live in wheat-cropping country on marginal land so there's plenty to go around. The main issue is $$$. It will not be a commercial venture... there simply is not enough demand for that kind of service out here. It's mainly for fun. Having said that... I would imagine that we'll try to encourage other local bands (local = the five or so other bands within 200kms!) to visit & record demo quality tracks here once we're set up. If interest does grow... who knows? A long term plan would be to build a separate & sound-isolated control/mixing room. This would solve most of the tracking and mixing issues you've highlighted. The music style being recorded will generally be rock... so mainly electric guitars, bass & drums. You can check out my fledgling attempts at recording&mixing by following the link in my sig. If you do... check out Tush to hear the best example of our band so far (that's not saying a lot) and for my solo gear, listen to Lost my Pants. I do appreciate there are some issues related to having an all-in-one tracking & mixing room... I think we'll just have to deal with it (like you said, dampening/moving offending equipment out when mixing... gobos... tracking only one instrument at a time... etc) until we can convince our wives and girlfriends to let us build a separate room for mixing. :x So... after clarifying a few things (sorry for the monster post!) I'm back to my original question regarding the materials... what should we be looking at using?

You want to build a solid structure using contemporary methods and materials available to your country. If you do not know what either of these are, talk to those that do. In the long run, folks who try to use one product in place of another will either spend more overall or weaken the structure, or both. There will be differences in how your build will sound based on what you use for the interiors. I do not see 15K being enough to build much when you put a concrete slab under it and add hvac. But there are other options, like modular buildings or containers and others I haven't even thought of yet:) Good luck and welcome.

Steel power poles and coopers ale. Look into steel framing as an option, as I think wood is a bit more expensive there. Choose a sq meter that will fit all your gear and then add a room ratio. Rain- Insulate the roof A high pitched ceiling would be wise as well. An inside up wall design??? So many things to think about. Patio area, bar, electrical options

Thanks for the replies everyone :D

Steel power poles and coopers ale.

hehehe, go the south aussies :wink:

Look into steel framing as an option, as I think wood is a bit more expensive there.

Yeah, that is no joke... one of the biggest single costs in the build will be transport of materials... I got a quote on some rigid fibreglass similar to OC703... the local hardware store quoted $310 for a pack... an Adelaide dealer is selling the same gear to me for $180! So as you can imagine I'm going to try and trailer-haul as much of the gear as I can!

I do not see 15K being enough to build much when you put a concrete slab under it and add hvac.

Is a slab essential? Is it inappropriate to build a "house on stilts" type of setup? This may be a dumb question. Every time I ask something on this website I cringe at the anticipated flaming for not having read Rod G's book yet!

But there are other options, like modular buildings or containers and others I haven't even thought of yet:)

Yeah, cheers for those ideas too :) Buying a cheap 2nd hand transportable room is a definite possibility, as long as the price is right and the transport won't be too much. Cheers for the help everyone :D

Is a slab essential? Is it inappropriate to build a "house on stilts" type of setup? This may be a dumb question. Every time I ask something on this website I cringe at the anticipated flaming for not having read Rod G's book yet!

Well, if isolation is not an issue, then you can probably live without a slab, I would think. I'm sure there are plenty of studios around that are built over wooden floors. However, don't forget that whatever you build as your base, it needs to be very tough: You are going to have a LOT of mass sitting on top of it. Even if you don't go for excellent isolation initially, you'll still be loading up a lot of thick gypsum board, framing, etc.. Not to mention equipment, people, acoustic treatment, beer.... And if you do want to keep your options open for the future, to perhaps improve the isolation with extra layers, then you should plan for that now, by building a really tough base. - Stuart -

TheBardOfBlasphemy wrote:

Is a slab essential? Is it inappropriate to build a "house on stilts" type of setup? This may be a dumb question. Every time I ask something on this website I cringe at the anticipated flaming for not having read Rod G's book yet!

I don't think anyone is going to flame you for not having read this book. I haven't read it and I still get flamed on occasion :) But, no, you can build anyway that your money and local construction practice allow. But when you consider how to spend your money, and what is going to be the best overall, a slab is easier to do and will move the project along quicker possibly with less cost. I do not know costs in your country so this is why I say possibly.

Not to mention equipment, people, acoustic treatment, beer....

you found the main important subject here in germany! 8) :wink: cheers mika