New Build, Looking for best design...

Hi guys! 1st post in a while. We're getting closer to starting the build, and are now looking for the best way to layout the internal rooms within this footprint. What we would like is: Drum Booth Vocal Booth Live Room Control Room and if possible at all, some kind of green room...? The structure will be made of block, with a almost flat sloped roof I will post my own designs when i have a moment to draw them, but for now i thought i'd put it out there.. Thanks in advance p.s. there can be no doors on the 36ft or 24ft walls Sorry i initially put this in the wrong forum...

Welcome back Alex and Nick! There has been a growing frustration here since you were last active with incomplete information from posters asking for design help. New posters are invariably directed to the Read This Before You Post at the top of the forum. For people not familiar with what you are doing: budget, space requirements, isolation needs are all important. You have covered much of this, along with design evolution in previous threads like this one and this one. If you would provide all the relevant information in one post, with links to others, you will get a much better response. Good luck! Andre

Hi Avare Apologies! All that just seemed a long time ago, and since then I have read Rod's book, and want to start fresh. Our Budget is not huge. enough for the external build, and internal walls, but all in good time, and all by ourselves where we can. Thanks for linking the old threads to tell you the truth, i almost forgot about those designs... as you can see, we are a way from anyone else. however we still need decent isolation, inside and out I'd just like some fresh input, as the more responce we can get, the better final product we hope to achieve Cheers

I feel like I am starting to play 20 questions. You wrote that you have read "the book" and have new ideas. What are they? We are not mind readers to know what has gone through your design concept/process already. Is the 8' external height fixed? If it is, you are looking at 1 7' inside height at best. What is "decent isolation?" For the benefit of other potential helpers here, the building id in the back of a beautiful garden. Are comfortable with brick work? No washrooms? Is it a purely private studio or commercial or something in between? I strongly suggest getting and using Sketchup. It is free and an informal standard for design here. Andre

right... lets leave this then shall we... i may have read a book, but i'm no expert or designer... Last time i was here, it was much more accomodating for 1st time studio's, and enthusiasts. Yes, we are comfortable with the block work i am a live sound technician but my father is a jack of all trades as we are say 80 - 100 meters away from the nearest neighbour, a little spill from the extremities is ok. basically, block single skin walls dry wall internal rooms, 1 inch off the wall and each other, insulated, double plaster board, green glue i'm just looking to see if anyone's has a new take on the position of rooms, and use of space cheers

Alex...is this (Image2.jpg) the exterior walls of your building? Which wall will the top of the rafter sit on?

Apologies, I thought i'd mentioned that it was plan (top) view. My mistake The rafters will have to go across the width as it's shorter. Also, i don't think i answered your other question regarding height. We thought 8ft to allow a foot of space within the ceiling.. cheers

Me again :) So the picture is actually the end of building view with a 15 foot tall wall, a 24 foot tall wall and a 36 foot base run, rafters going from 15 foot wall to 24 foot wall?

Hi, No sorry it's the footprint so top view these are the 4 exterior walls Thanks

Is the trapezoid shape of this footprint a requirement? It makes for difficult framing of the roof. You will have a roof that starts at one pitch and ends with another pitch.

Hi Xspace, the shape is to due to shape of the garden, this is the biggest building we can fit in, with room for access to what will be the studio garden, would the pitch change...? or just be longer at one end than the other...?

What happens is as the wall moves in the distance from the bottom of the rafter to the top of the wall increases. So if the rafter is simply mated with this wall..it will be at a position farther in then the first rafter notch, which will begin to create a fall. But I'm still not clear on the width. You said "The rafters will have to go across the width as it's shorter. " but I still do not know which of the shorter dimensions you refer to, 15 or 24? Or both if they are the tail walls and this has a ridge located in the center of the 36 foot dimension going from straight wall to angled wall :) Really, I don't do drugs :).

Hi Here's a quick sketch-up pic got to go to sleep now, thanks for taking an interest speak soon

Ok, I see said the blind man. If I was doing this, I would push(the owners) to have the rafter tails land on the straight long side of the building. This would ensure an even wall height for your bird mouth and all measuring. I do not know UK requirements for roof systems so this is just me thinking out loud on how I would frame this monkey! Anyway, to get any degree of pitch will require that a knee wall is built of sufficient height across the top of the angled wall where the rafter tops will rest. I'm going to use 4 ft. as my reference knee wall height. First I'd install a pressure treated 2X6 laying flat on the top of the block wall, for my example, all around the perimeter. This will allow me to build and attach the knee wall onto for our height requirement. Nail the bottom of a temporary 4 ft. stud(vertical) secured to this pressure treated board. The rafter tail would have already been established and birdsmouth cut out on one of my long rafters. I'd leave the length of the rafter uncut until we know more about the length. One man on the high side holding the rafter on to the >side< of the vertical temporary stud and one man on the bird mouth side holding the rafter tight to the wall. Have your man at the rafter tail end drive at least two nails into the birdsmouth securely into the plate. Plumb up the temporary stud as if it is a wall and then you may nail the rafter to the side of the stud. After it is nailed, mark the rafter around this temporary stud as you will also have a notch/birdsmouth at the top of each rafter. This rafter and stud need to be able to stand unattended for some time while you get some more figures. While still on the side with the temporary stud and rafter, measure from hooking the birdsmouth wall area back towards the temporary vertical stud 15 feet and make a mark on the top of wall plate at the 15 feet intersection. This is the distance of your short side wall correct? It is better to actually measure the existing shorter side(hooking outside wall to outside wall) to make certain that your measurement is as accurate as possible. We will use 15 feet since that is the goal. Once the mark has been made, using a level, plumb up from this 15 ft mark along side the rafter. Mark along side the level onto the rafter. Measure the distance from the >top< of the rafter down to butting the plate laid on the wall. This is the height that the other end of your kneewall has to be in order for the rafter tops to remain level. So one end of the kneewall will be 48 inches and the other end is whatever the measurement is that you just located. Since it is always best to use a double plate for loads like a rafter end, subtract 3 inches from the 48 inch measurement and 3 inches from the number you found from the above process. (3 inches is the thickness of two nominal 2X4's, a 2X4 being actually 1-1/2 inch X 3-1/2 inch , your measurements may vary) Cut a stud to these shorter measurements and install them on their respective ends of the building. Then attach a string line across the top of these vertical members. If you laid out your top of block wall plate already you can measure from this plate to the string and have those boards cut and get them installed. Once complete with the vertical studs you can cut and install the top plates for the kneewall. You should already have joists installed so a great idea would be to nail a diagonal board about every 48 inches from one of these joists to the kneewall stud to hold the wall plumb and keep it stationary. Then lay the top of the kneewall out from the longest rafter side to the shortest rafter side for your rafters. (((((((((((((((Please be careful. Do not depend on this wall to keep you in the air or out of harms way. It may not.)))))))))))))))))) Now you may install the original rafter on too the first layout place. It should be a simple process of "squaring" over from the next layout mark back to the newly installed rafter. This will let you determine what the next (shorter) rafter length will be, bird mouth to top plate. Continue this process until all rafters are up and you have reached the 15 ft side. The rafter will get shorter on the top side but the bird mouth and tail will remain the same. This should keep the top of the roof line straight and the decking area flat. Make sense? As a point of interest, if you use the nonparallel side wall for the birds mouth, your tails may twist out of a straight line configuration if the math isn't worked out :) Conversely, the tails can do this same twist if they are laid on the parallel wall side and the top math isn't worked out .

Thanks for all that info X, bit over my head to tell you the truth, but an excellent post all the same thanks again! I think we're gonna go for a pitched roof now, to shorten the joists, and hopefully to avoid the stated problems above. I've done some more Sketch-up's And was hoping to get some variations on design, any ideas would be greatly appreciated! At the moment i'm finding it hard to find the best use of space. here's the pics, they've come out a bit small, so i'll make the bigger if needed Thanks in Advance!

Last time i was here, it was much more accommodating for 1st time studio's, and enthusiasts.

Yes, it probably was. But it is tiring to keep answering the same questions. You first need to realize what you want for that room. Then see if there's enough space for what you want. You can do this easily in a 2D schematic, forget 3D for now. Just check the total floor area you have and the area of each room. Maybe you end up concluding you cannot build everything you want (or not)

Hi andrebrito, True, i can relate to that! :D We're going to string it out tonight and have a look... however, i am not the best designer, and was just looking for other input Thanks