Studio Châteauneuf

Hey Gang, Well, not my first post but pretty close to it. I'll try to not make this too long winded. But a succession of studios is going in, and I'd like to do it all right here. Do it right, with your help, and document it all. The first studio is going into an existing residential structure, the second is the transformation of a hotel into a turn key recording, mix and mastering facility. More will come as time goes on, but a little background first. I'm creating what's called here in France an "Association". Long story, but it gives me legal cover to operate as long as I have a cause. That cause being the preservation and promotion of Franco-European original music, with an emphasis on young artists. Giving them a break with a business plan that gives them real experiences and no long term commitments. In short, helping the young get a leg up on The Machine--the recording industry as it is today. Much more to tell, but I promised to keep it short. Well, here it is, I have a studio now, but we're moving to other digs. That, and I have this deal on a line to acquire this hotel, transform it into recording studio with full hotel services for people that come, stay, and record their next big album in an exotic setting away from it all on the Riviera. Cool eh? But that deal will take this next year to come down as I'm holding out for capital improvements: a parking lot has got to move and another built. So, the studio in the new digs. Hard to find anything around here that would accomodate 4 kids, 2 cats, 2 dogs...and a French wife. Problem is that I have the challenge of very low ceilings. I have to measure, but they may be just over 2 meters in the places this thing is to go. Budget? For the residential, probably about 10K€ is the most I want to spend. For the hotel, we have financial backing, and the people around us to make it happen. The house is first. Material of the rooms is concrete. There are issues which I'll elaborate as we go. Concrete slab on earth if not directly on bed rock--built into the side of a mountain. One long side is back filled about 2/3 the height of the wall. So, lets get busy. For my part, I pledge to pay attention, read everything on this forum (as if I haven't already), and order The Book (which I have already). Further, I will follow all instructions to the letter as they are negotiated. And, I will document everything right here, right up to the first act recorded. And, as a bonus, I will include a running blog of the acquisition of this hotel gig. If we make the deal happen, then we go for the full enchilada together. So, anyone interested in playing along? It's not just putting up walls; I believe that there are significant challenges to overcome to make an acoustically correct recording and mixing enviroment. On the construction side, I used to build houses and do remodeling before I decided to get an education and get paid for not working for a living. I have been working seriously on methods and acquiring equipment for my studio for 8 years now, and I have been recording for many more years, while I have been a musician since I was 5...I'm now 50. I want to do this.

the low ceiling will be the biggest challenge (in the home studio) and depending on what your isolation requirements are, may be even tougher. maybe you can post detailed measurements of the space and what your requirements are - music/work type, isolation needs, environmental and infrastructure noise, construction, etc. as long as the dimensions are accurate and include things like plumbing, ducting, structure, utilities, doors, windows, etc that shape the space, you can provide it via hand sketch (scanned or photo), sketchup (a 2d drawing works), other other tools. on the commercial project, since you'll have investors, i'd recommend you get a pro design to reduce risk.

Thanks for the reply, Gullfo. Yes I plan to provide all details. Fortunately, neighbors are far off and I'm on a sizeable piece of land, but still have to mitigate the noise as much as possible. I've got a couple of clients that do heavy metal, but there'll be a drum room that will be isolated with only one exterior wall that's poured concrete and backed by land fill. At any rate, I will be providing detailed layouts soon. And, yes, the ceilings appear to be the most challenging aspect. I'll be using sketchup do communicate things--just got to learn it but no big deal it appears. The commercial project will come afterwards, but there are not many firms in France that really know what they're doing. We'll have to see but there's time.

Okay, we signed off on the house tonight, so in we go. I wanted to take measurements but it was just too damn cold. Now, it's full tilt boogie on the move. I want accurate measurements of anything and everything, including duct and pipe work. There is no ducting, as all rooms are individual electric which brings up the fact that these rooms are not currently heated; this is the Riviera, but it still gets down to zero. That's zero, celcius. :) I'll pick this up again in a couple of weeks with at least the floor plan. Been messing with sketchup and saw some video, made some trial floor plans...nice tool. Yeah, the Riviera is a big place. We're in the Alps Maritimes not far from Nice.

I'm not sure if I'm doing this right, but I'm attaching a file to show the new space I have to work with. This is the live room and drum room. The control room will be on the other side of the drum room through a concrete wall in a room that's 7.4 x 3.4 x 1.9 meters. Yeah, that's the big challenge. A 1.9 meter concrete ceiling. Any thoughts?

I hope I haven't breached any forum etiquette. I'd have liked to display the sketchup file but I'm not sure how to do so. Just another note is that I don't need soundproofing, aside from sealing up the large garage door opening. Other than that, it's treatment I'm after. If more information is needed, please let me know. I think I have read everything I should have here, and this afternoon I go to the post office to pick up "The Book".

DCinFrance wrote:

A 1.9 meter concrete ceiling. Any thoughts?

I would say you French are very short people. There is no way I could get that approved here in Australia. 2.8m minimum here. Us Aussis are very big people....except me, I'm only 5' 8". Isn't that funny. All my measurements are metric except my hight???

Actually, I'm American...and about the same height as yourself. I've been living here for 10 years now, and the irony is that Europeans in general are a lot taller (especially it seems the Dutch). In the states, I could stand in crowded room and half would be shorter. Here, I'm easily in the short half of the crowd. Anyway! I need some advice you guys!

The Book is here! Bizarre, I order from France to Amazon in the States by an American author no less and it comes by slow banana boat from Australia. This is very well written--I like Rod's no nonsense approach. I think we could be buddies. Chapter 2 is worth its' weight in gold. I also picked up Mitch Gallagher's "Acoustic Design for the Home Studio". We'll get to that next. So, people, are these low ceilings so hopeless that it doesn't merit a response? Or, have I not somehow followed the rules? I'd love to display the file as opposed to having busy people download it, but, though I've looked around, don't see a sticky that says anything about it. Just a word on that alone might be helpful. A note on the commercial property--the hotel. We went back with a team to continue our dialog. One thing's for sure, we want some capital improvements. In particular, a parking lot has to move. They have it right in front of the dining room, where here in the Riviera, the long line of french doors facing the dining room, and the parking lot, would be open. Just what you want. Exhaust fumes from cars going in and out pumped straight into the dining room. What were they thinking? So, capital improvements BEFORE we make the move. They are mulling it over.

Under file in sketchup, export it as a JPEG no bigger than 700 pixels wide. Post the JPEG on your thread You got the book from Australia? I've been looking for a copy to buy from Australia everywhere. I don't want to pay $20 to get sent from the USA, not for a $20 book anyway????! Anyone got a copy in Australia they want to pass onto me? Cheers

Thanks, Drum. I had looked at export 3D, but not the 2D, not expecting to export in jpg. Yup, post marked out of OZ. Go figure. Evidently there is inventory there. Here's the picture of my miserably low ceiling'd space:

my first thought is that 1.9m is way too low. if this is for your own personal use and you sit pretty much all the time, you can probably build yourself a small workstation space. if you're planning on other musicians performing there, you're likely to find it a fairly uncomfortable height. depending on what you need for isolation - you just might not have enough room to be useful. you could use it for an amp room or potentially a reverb chamber but i'd suggest finding something with more height. if not, then there are plenty of examples posted here for room treatments which could tame the space.

Thanks Glenn, Yeah, this is in no means other than for myself and others to do demos and what not. I'm bummed because it was difficult enough finding something that could handle my family needs, let alone the studio. I remember that going through it, I was so relieved to find a decent, modern home that could hold 4 kids, 2 dogs, 2 cats and a French wife ( :roll: ) AND have a place to install the studio. Given that, I brushed away the "gee, the ceilings are a little low". When we went in again to close the deal, I went, damn, they're lower than I remember. :cry: No, isolation within the house is not a big deal. However, I have to do something about that garage door openning (I think the original design of the house was to incorporate two garages, one on each side, but in the end it looks like they never made either garages...there's no approach to them). There are some bi-fold wood doors in the hole, and I see nothing but big time day light through them. That is going to be need closed with some degree of isolation...it's basically wide open to sound.

You could always dig out the floor like Lou did? check out Lou's construction thread.

Yeah, I've been kicking that around in my mind. Big work, big expense. Of course, that goes beyond DIY in that I'll need structural engineers to determine first what effect removing the floor has on the foundation, and second to determine what's below and what to do about it. I'm on the side of a mountain, and I believe that I'm on solid bedrock, and if that's the case, I'm not going anywhere with that. We've seen a lot of places around here, and at least a half dozen that had basements had a HUGE rock--boulder--right in the middle of the place...too big to do anything about so they just build around it.

i think in that case, just accept what you cannot change and put in a bunch of absorption traps and panels to get the rooms sounding good and remember to duck when you go in ;-)