Will my box of wire work?

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bigdaddyd
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Location: spokane, wa

Will my box of wire work?

Post by bigdaddyd »

My 30x32 shop is up, and will begin inside framing and wiring in the next week. 1/2 of it will be my jam room and recording room/ office. I have a box of 2 pair ( one black and red twisted together and in a foil shield, and one white and green in a foil shield) This is a line level wire used in the home theatre wiring that we run non amplified audio on. RCA plugs for left and right.

Can I use this for mic runs, and XLR runs from my Line 6 to my recording room?

It was rather expensive, I have almost 1000 feet, and would love to use it but dont want to cut corners.

It basically has the look of a CAT5 phone cable, the wires are stranded and I think 18 or 22 guage. they are shielded in pairs, and shielded again just under the grey outside plastic casing. Ive seen this used in the sound wiring at the quick build projects ive been on.

thanx.

g
If someone chops down your family tree, plant a new one and care for it yourself.
bigdaddyd
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Post by bigdaddyd »

I found this post, probably the same wire, same question. Ill call my vendors and see what I can find out.

http://www.johnlsayers.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=1228
If someone chops down your family tree, plant a new one and care for it yourself.
Aaronw
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Post by Aaronw »

Is it just foil wrapped or does it have a drain wire/shield?

Who makes it and/or model # of the wire?
Jester
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Post by Jester »

I never really got a response about whether the wire I have is any good. I was given about 7 or 8 hundred feet of the stuff and I would love to use it if it's any good. The guy who gave it to me does a lot of installs and thought it was pretty good wire. It's mini wire and says “West Penn wire CL2291 2 COND 22 AWG STD Shielded type CL2 75 C (UL)” Think it might be usable for mic runs?
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Post by Aaronw »

Typically the West Penn wire stuff is used for commercial installations such as restaurants, retail, churches, etc.

Personally it wouldn't be in my top 5 choices of wire to use for a studio install.

Here's the spec's:
http://www.westpenn-cdt.com/pdfs/CommCablesPDFs/291.pdf
Jester
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Post by Jester »

Yeah I think this did come out of a church. I guess I will use it to make snakes for stage use then. So what are the top five you would recommend? Balanced, unbalanced and speaker.
bigdaddyd
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Post by bigdaddyd »

My box says 2 pair ind shield- made by atlas wire and cable- And there are three phone numbers right here on the box. I guess I should call one and just ask, huh?!? :oops:

If any would like the #'s, LMK.

My big worry is that someone will say, 'Yeah- our wire is good for any line level wiring'... when it may not be what I really want because there is something better.

A quick note on wiring and manufacturers. 4 years ago I took a 'workshop' in CAT5 wiring. We had a manufacturers rep teaching hook up technique, correct useage, etc., and answering questions. I asked the difference between CAT5 and CAT5e, you know... the "ENHANCED" wire. It costs more to purchase, and is sold to home owners as an upgrade. The rep said it comes off the same wire making machine as CAT5, only it is tested or verified for a quicker speed, and mark it with an E.

I was installing a quick simple theatre for a home owner (I've never sold myself as a high end theatre installer though) and the owner requested "monster cable" brand. I did some research and found the same to be true with theatre wiring. The moster cable brand has a sister wire company that sells "synphony" cable to electrical wholesalers that is one third the price, different brand name, comes off the same machine. The local experts that sold monster cable said that such a wire was not the same, did not exist, and would compromise the install- obviously they were biased by the sale of their product. The local CAT5e tradespeople said the same thing about the cat 5, even though I talked to the rep. MY POINT?-

If you have a wire and your not sure if you can use it, you have to trust your judgement, or just spend money for the product that everyone says is the correct product. In the instance above, both wires were the exact idinticle product only labeled different, but the experts (not the manufacturers) said they would not work. The manufacturers said they were identicle.

The good thing is that when you take away the bias of 'making a sale' and pose questions to a group, like this site, that are interested in truth and experience, not money, there is a better chance for correct information.

Finally my point is this, this 2 pair wire that I have may work for some things, may work for my jam room, but I believe I will spend for a product that is agreed to be made specifically for my install- UNLESS i find out that it comes off the same production line, then I will let you all know.

g
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Aaronw
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Post by Aaronw »

So what are the top five you would recommend?
Mogami, Canare, Gepco, Horizon, and anything other than WPW. I'd even use belden over WPW.
Guest

Post by Guest »

Just talked to a "studio installation tech" at hoffmans music ( the only music store in spokane that is into wiring studio that will let you question their tech's) and he said the wire he uses for mic and xlr is a "westpenn 292. Its one pair of stranded 22 quage with a shield. I have two pair, each shielded, 22 guage. I will take a piece to him and see if my stuff will work.

Sounds the same to me. Well see. Ill let ya know.

g
bigdaddyd
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Post by bigdaddyd »

that was me :oops:
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Post by Aaronw »

BTW...the company I work for, we use WPW all day long for commercial installs. But we use it 70v commercial systems. Also, we use the shielded stuff for host mic paging, telephone paging, etc.

Not that it's bad wire, it's just not at the top of list for professional recording studio use. I don't remember what the frequency characteristics, or impeadance stats are, but there is a difference in how it sounds compared to mogami or other studio grade cables.

If all you're doing is just demo quality stuff anyway, and on a tight budget, and using consumer grade audio gear, you'll probably not even know the difference.

But if you've got good ears, you want good, clear sounding signals, using good mics, good pre's, and making a descent recording (aside from the musicians), you will hear a difference. Don't skimp on the wire.

There are places it may be used, but primarily short runs, or just a single run to a distant location. The WPW stuff is cheap (like 6 cents a foot).

That's my take on it. :)

Aaron
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Post by Guest »

OK, this guy who was head of their install department that does all the custom commercial and residential studio stuff around town said the following about the wire I brought in.

he said that the wire I have is EXACTLY the same in the manner of size, shielding, insulation jacket, etc... Except for the fact that I have a 2 pair and his are single pair. He said that if I were to take advantage of the second pair I could hook them up this way;

All the shielding foil as well as the stranded bare chord are all hooked up to the one terminal (ground?!?) Then take one pair and use them together for the next terminal, then the last pair for the remaining. He said if anything this would be a better quality hook up than they usually install as each of the signal wires would be shielded in their own pair isolated from the other. And the wire would have double the area to travel in as I would be using both #22 wires in one pair to send the signal on. He said it would help for longer runs.

He made comment that my wire that I have was of great quality and he would definatly use it up.

I said are there any compromises. He said if there are, then any studio he's wired would have been compromised as thats the same wire they use, only different brand, and one more pair.

AAron made a good point, This jam room of mine isnt being completed to be a commercial quality anything, just quality jam room and a little weekend recording. So...EVEN if there is the slightest compromise, it will be ok with me.
bigdaddyd
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Post by bigdaddyd »

DAng it, keeps logging me off, that was me.....
( how do i fix that, im supposed to log on each visit..... :shock:
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Post by knightfly »

If you have cookies enabled, (and possibly javascript) in your browser, and you check the "remember me" box in the log-in dialog, that should do it... Steve
Aaronw
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Post by Aaronw »

I'd say use it up. You'll be fine. I use a lot of this WPW around my house for my outside deck speakers, etc. (same reason...free)

Like I said, it's not bad cable, but if you were pulling 24 pair snakes, etc, I'd use the good stuff. And for your application, it's not a big deal.

You're in Spokane, huh? Does this guy work for Crows Nest?

:D
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