John Sayers' Recording Studio Design Forum Archive

Dimensions have improved also, but the main service panel for the house is in the back corner, and codes dictate I have 36" of space in front of it, so I'm thinking of putting a hallway right off the stairs, with a door leading into it, and then another door leading into the studio in-between rear wall bass traps.

I don't see/understand where you say the stairs are going to be. I think your service panel room frame doesn't make sense. You will need to frame in that room by itself. Right now, it's frame is touching your inner leaf frame of your control room.

Regarding your breaker panel, you could just box around it and have a couch or something 36" in front of it. That way your control room is bigger. Have your door just right (on the picture) of the jack post.

I'm in the same situation as before, the bottom of the studs sit at 7' 5", so i really don't want to sit an inside out ceiling sitting on outer studs, since the span would dictate 2x8 joists (right?).

Most likely LVL studs that are 1 1/2" x 7 1/4".

if I beef up between joists with 1.25" of drywall, stuff the space with fluffy insulation, then the RC and 1" of drywall, do I calculate the MSM in the same way, even with ceiling and subfloor not being isolated from each other on the joists? I'm not sure how to calculate in the resilient channel in that equation either. Does that make sense?

Great question. I don't know if an accurate equation exists for RC builds. Since there is direct flanking (yes, it's limited via the RC, but it's still touching), you're probably achieving slightly better isolation in higher frequencies, but for low frequencies, you're maybe only achieving the same levels of transmission loss as a regular wall. And sadly, low frequencies are what we all strive to isolate. RC is known for poor LF isolation.

Greg

wow, I screwed up the screenshot, amateur hour over here...

New picture attached.

The reason I didn't initially just keep the panel in the room is I wanted to bass trap the back corners, and that's where the panel is. I'm interested in other solutions for sure though!

The reason I was thinking I wouldn't want to put a double-leaf on the rear wall is if I did that then the wall/door to the stairway (which you can now see) would be a third leaf, right? Same with the cinder block wall the panel is on? Most of that is below-grade, but the portion that isn't would be a third leaf, right?

if I beef up between joists with 1.25" of drywall, stuff the space with fluffy insulation, then the RC and 1" of drywall, do I calculate the MSM in the same way, even with ceiling and subfloor not being isolated from each other on the joists? I'm not sure how to calculate in the resilient channel in that equation either. Does that make sense?

Yes, in the same way. RC decouples fairly well... just not as well as a separate stud frame. So the MSM resonant frequency is still calculated using the same equation. The same equation applies to all MSM structures, even partly-coupled ones. The MSM equation is always the same, but the isolation is not, of course. Don't forget to allow for the extra depth of the RC itself, when you figure out the depth of the cavity.

- Stuart -

Cool, thanks Stuart. After I calculate isolation, how would I adjust the number (up or down) to account for RC coupling?

thedavidlim wrote:Cool, thanks Stuart. After I calculate isolation, how would I adjust the number (up or down) to account for RC coupling?

See if you can google "NRCC-44692" to download. It's from the Canadian Research Council. It used to be easy to find research papers on their website, but they have now made it basically impossible... ("Oh! Canada!"). The actual title of the paper is "A Simple model of the sound insulation of gypsum board on resilient supports". It lays out all the factors, and shows you how to figure that out.


- Stuart -

http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/do ... 1&type=pdf

Found this, for your archive.

How would you approach the back wall in my picture? The service panel is in the corner, where I'd normally want to bass trap, and I can't cover it up unless there's some kind of access door. My initial solution was a hallway from the stairway to the wall, with a door right off the stairs and another into the studio.

I could bass trap somewhere besides corners, open it up all the way to the wall and put a door in the left wall behind the stairs instead of at the foot, but not sure how to design that.

Just bumping. Framing out the rest of the basement (living space) currently, so am trying to move forward with studio too

Still trying to figure out how to work this room. The main electrical panel is in the lower right-hand corner, in the stud wall, so I thought about putting a hallway there in order to keep the required 36" clearance in front of the panel. If I don't do that, I need to figure out where to put the door, but also how to bass trap the corner without completely blocking the panel. I'm sure there are better ways to do it than this, but this works, and the room dimension is square in the middle of the Bolt area, so that works too.

Thoughts?

Hey, just seeing if anyone's still around, or if I've somehow worn out my welcome

Sorry about the late reply. It's really hard to find an hour or two to nerd out on the forum when I should be spending the time making money or spending time with my family :-S Trying hard here as it seems Stuart and I are the only ones answering questions. Having said that, if anyone can help anyone here so they don't sit waiting for some answers, please reply to them!

Your idea of having the hallway there should be fine. EXCEPT, your room in a room design is flawed. First off, it appears your rear control room wall has 2 walls run parallel to one another. This is fine if the ends of them weren't anchored together via your inner leaf side walls! The bottom most rear control room wall assembly (the one pretty much in your electrical panel "hallway" should be your control room outer leaf wall. It should go from your outer leaf wall at your stairs and complete your control room outer leaf by contacting your foundation wall. THEN your MSM system will be correct. Now, that then means you won't need the extra little wall for a second door in that "hallway". This room could just be a great storage room. You could also build it into an amp room or with a bunch of treatment even a small vocal/overdub booth. It's not huge and would never sound incredible, but like all of us, you have to work with what you've got!

What is the grey computer screen looking thing at the front of your control room between the walls?

Greg

Thank you!

I know everyone’s busy, I’m grateful for the response!

Good catch on those walls, that makes sense, I see the problem.

Glad the hallway/storage won’t screw me up, kind hoped there was a better way to work around the panel to get back that extra 4’, but short of a super chunk corner that can swing open somehow and a different door location I’m not sure what I’d do. Both dimensions (with or without hallway) fall within Bolt area., so that’s nice.

That “screen” is a screen, but didn’t get moved when I moved the walls from where they were and I forgot to delete it. There’s an hvac duct for the house that runs below the joists there, so I have played with soffiting it across the top of the front wall versus making the gap larger between leaves. The duct will also have to run down the side, along the block wall, to feed the living room above, so I’ll have to soffit that in and make an empty one on the other side for symmetry. Any opinions on the front wall, hvac soffit versus larger gap in the wall (by about 6-8”)?

Thanks so much for your time!

The main beam for your house leads me to believe that the joists run left to right in your picture. Why would there be duct hanging below the joists is this is the case? A real life picture of that would be great to see.

Greg

Sorry about the late reply. It's really hard to find an hour or two to nerd out on the forum when I should be spending the time making money or spending time with my family :-S Trying hard here as it seems Stuart and I are the only ones answering questions. Having said that, if anyone can help anyone here so they don't sit waiting for some answers, please reply to them!

+50!!

- Stuart -

Thanks for all you guys do! I know the time spent here is extra for you, but you have a whole community that appreciates you!

Hey all, still working on design as I build other parts of the house out. Re-working things to try and get the most volume, but that means the overall dimensions (acoustically) is 20'9" x 11'2", very close to half as wide as it is long. I can cut 2' off an end and get into Bolt area, but that puts my volume around 180sf instead of 220sf. Ceiling will end up around 7'5, so not very high. Is it better to keep the volume and try to trap the low end modes? Or cut the volume and end up with a "better" dimension?