John Sayers' Recording Studio Design Forum Archive

Sad that you can't find a contractor... But have you considered being your OWN contractor? There's probably a lot you can do yourself, especially if you have friends in the construction business....




- Stuart -

Yes, my plan B is to act as my own general contractor, do a lot of the work myself, and make it easy on a concrete contractor, plumber, framer, roofer, electrician, etc. to each do their part as I go along. I will start on that path now. If one of the general contractors gives me a reasonable price, I will gladly let them take over to speed up the process. I will start demolition of the wood deck and pool decking this weekend.

Erik

I did get one general contractor to go over my plans, asked some questions, and gave me a budget range of $50k to $60k for the project. That is a bit above my $40k budget. They suggested single 2x6 walls, closed cell foam insulation, and sound board to reduce the costs. I explained to them why that wouldn't work for my low frequencies. I asked if they would allow me to do portions of the work to reduce the budget and simply build the structure and I would finish out the inner leaf, etc. They quit responding to me.

I have one last try at plan "A" to hire a general contractor. We just found out the contractor that replaced our roof a few years ago, whom we like, also does remodeling and general contracting work. We had a meeting. He understood the isolation techniques, had some good suggestions on some other matters, and is currently working on the budget. The demolition is well underway and will be excluded from his budget. Hopefully, this will work out. Otherwise, continue on with plan "B" of hiring myself as the general contractor.

Pictures to follow on the demolition process. Rented a concrete floor saw and jack hammer, called in some friends and started hauling debris away.

They suggested single 2x6 walls, closed cell foam insulation, and sound board

Ummmm... it's probably a good thing that they DID stop responding! Clearly not the right guys for the job, if they don't have a clue about isolation....

Let's hope this roofing guy works out for you. And since you have experienced his work before, that's a good sign.

I did get one general contractor to go over my plans, asked some questions, and gave me a budget range of $50k to $60k for the project.

I went back over your thread quickly, but couldn't easily see how many square feet of floor space this studio is going to be: How big is it? It certainly doesn't seem to be large enough to need a 60k budget, though, especially if you are doing a lot of the work yourself.

- Stuart -

The room is roughly 17' x 23' for 391 sf including the bathroom. The project does require breaking into the existing garage roof and re-framing and re-building about 300 sf of the existing garage roof. Construction costs were around the $100/sf range a few years ago, but I mentioned the premium we are experiencing right now in this market. I would guess maybe more like $120/sf plus the 20% extra for the sound isolation would be about $140 x 391 sf is $54,740 plus some extra for the garage roof, minus some for work being done by myself. So it seems like it might be a reasonable number for this area in this market at the moment. But on the other hand, it is a pretty simple structure in my opinion. The only work I would be doing in this scenario is the demolition, which is nearly done, then the acoustic treatments and painting on the interior. I keep trying to get the general contractors to allow me to do more myself but they don't seem very receptive to that. I can understand the issue if something isn't quite right and they did not have complete control over all aspects of the build, they would not want to be in that position. I will find out hopefully next week when I get a budget cost from the new contractor.

Erik

So my daughter did some pet sitting for one of her best friends. A malteepoo (half maltese half poodle), a very cute puppy. A week later my friend and guitar player in the band is helping me on the demolition phase of this room build and my wife walks up. He asks her "how long until you get one of those cute dogs?" She said "I'm not paying $2,000 for a dog. That's almost as stupid as paying $40,000 for a room to put your drums in". We all got a good laugh.

Demolition is about done. I met with the new general contractor, his electrician, framer, and plumber. They are really understanding what I am trying to accomplish. I am feeling optimistic. Went over some more details.

I have green glue between layers on the inner leaf in my design, but I mentioned earlier that I could not quantify the benefit in terms of transmission loss at any particular frequency in the low frequency range. My window design with 3/4" and 1/2" laminate glass with 9" space in between matches the wall transmission loss for the mass and space only with no consideration for green glue. The cost of the green glue is $1,200 plus labor to apply it and I cannot quantify the benefit. If the window is the weak link and anything above that on the walls may be a waste of money, I removed the green glue except for the triple leaf areas in order to save some money on the budget. Also, the general contractor stated he would not include the door or the window in the budget as he was having a difficult time with those two items. That is fine with me. I want to do more of the build to save on the budget anyway. He stated he could not find anyone to deliver the 3/4' AND 1/2" laminated glass. I thought I found one locally that could obtain it by special order. I will have to investigate more. Also, I will be responsible for the conduit for low voltage wiring under the slab.

Erik

Finally... I have an agreement with the general contractor. I will be over my budget, but somewhat closer. The only way to be within my budget is to do pretty much all of the work myself. I have little free time so it would take me a very long time to accomplish. Also, since the existing garage roof has to be torn apart, I am most concerned about getting the structure closed back up in a reasonable amount of time. So, I feel more comfortable having a general contractor who will be able to get it built relatively quickly I hope. In our discussion, there are several things that the contractor omitted that I will have to do myself in order to reduce the cost. Those things are: all plumbing for the bathroom, sink, toilet, cabinet, conduit under the slab for low voltage cables, sound baffle boxes for the ventilation system, super door, window, acoustic treatments. The contractor will handle the slab, framing, drywall and OSB layers, roof, electrical, hvac, siding, trim, paint, and gutters.

I ended up eliminating the green glue as I mentioned earlier. Also, I had specified 5/8" OSB which is a somewhat less common size. I reduced it to 7/16" OSB which reduced the cost. So, the double wall will be 2 layers of 7/16" OSB plus hardy siding on the outer leaf and 7/16" OSB and 5/8" drywall on the inner leaf. I am compromising a little bit on the sound isolation to get it within a reasonable budget. It should be fine. I will go back and re-calculate the equivalent glass surface density for the window.

The triple leaf ceiling components are "beefier" with triple layers of 5/8" drywall. I will post some of the final plan details.

Pictures will follow.

Erik

Sounds great! I'm looking forward to seeing the updated design.


- Stuart -

Here are my plans as ready to go to construction after a few revisions.

Erik

Continued...

Continued...

I started digging the hole to find the sanitary sewer main located in my back yard for the sanitary sewer plumbing lead connection for the bathroom. It was a little deeper than the record drawings indicated. I was a little surprised at how wide I needed to make the hole at the top just to have working room at that depth. The top of the existing 8" sewer line is 5 1/2 feet below grade. I am excavating by hand because of the existing high voltage electric and gas line in the vicinity. I called in the local "one call" system to have the locations of the existing utilities marked so I knew where they should be. I have not found the gas line yet, but that will be next since I have to go under or over it with the sewer service line. I need to open the hole up wider to excavate around the existing sewer main for the saddle type connection. I can't help but hum "Down In A Hole" by Alice In Chains while working here.

I also broke a hole through my existing garage slab to place conduit from the garage under the new slab in order to pass cables between the two without compromising the isolation walls. I am doing this in hopes of utilizing the existing room in the garage (or future expansion thereof) for an isolation room or future control room. There is no agreement from the wife for such a thing yet, so the three 1 1/2" conduits may have been a waste of time here, but a guy can hope. Or, at least prepare for the future. I added a 3/4" conduit for the controller for the ERV (ventilation) unit as well (not shown in the picture below), or whatever other needs may arise.

The contractor came and set the forms for the slab so I can get the conduit and plumbing in the precise locations.

Progress! I love progress!

Looking good...


- Stuart -